07-16-11, 07:17 PM | #151 | |
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As I recall, directions for mixing the MIX-111 called for it to be as stiff as possible and still work with the grout pump. Slab mix could be thicker yet, as there may not be a pump involved in the process. * * * * * I also recall seeing flyash and carbon additives in other thermally enhanced cementitious materials. I do not recall ever seeing a thermally enhanced slab mix ever being mentioned in any online discussion. Something like this could be combined with webaware's innovation. NOTE TO WEBAWARE: you need to give this thing a name, or somebody is likely to name it for you. Best regards, -AC_Hacker
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07-17-11, 12:09 AM | #152 |
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webaware, Thanks! This is great for me.
As I just had PEX installed with aluminum staple-up plates in a new addition, now I am thinking about the old parts of the house. -First floor - no problem, full access from basement -Second floor - ??? take down first floor ceiling? -Third floor - tongue-and-groove 1x8 planks, 70 years old, some have been lifted for access already, maybe it is time to lift more of them. (which would give me access for wiring 2nd floor :-) Your technique would do well for me here. First floor ceiling... there are a few places where I have access to the joist cavities for the first floor. (for example, a flooded bathtub ruined the ceiling in the foyer. I covered it with Luan until a project like this comes along.) The plaster on the wall on the stairs peeled away from the lath...So I took it off and put on drywall, but I left the ends of the joist cavities visible behind the lath. I will propose to the interior design team to use 1x10 to cover these, so forever access will be an option. (Team = wife + her friend :-) |
07-17-11, 01:09 AM | #153 | |
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I will be fixing 100mm fibreglass to the underside of the steel cladding for sound and thermal isolation. |
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07-17-11, 01:43 AM | #154 |
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Radiant heat 12' between joists
After seeing webaware's post,
I'm reviewing in my mind the options for putting radiant heat in existing floors. I have easy access to the joist cavities in much of the second floor. The question is, can I install radiant pipes and get the heat transfer needed? I'm thinking some wacky things... probably not worth it, but fun to consider. My friend bought a tiny video camera that he used to study a failed sewer pipe under the sidewalk - 20' from the cleanout. What if I found a way to put the pipe in the joist cavity (from the stairs, where it is open), and also put in plates... then with the camera, I could advise my friend how to drill small holes, and "staple up" the plates in between the joists, through 1/4" holes in the plaster and lath ceiling... Maybe there is an easier way. |
10-02-11, 10:08 PM | #155 |
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Pumps
Well,
Winter is coming, so it is time to act. The main question I have today is, what are people using to pump hot water around their hydronic floors? I went to a plumbing supply house, and they were happy to nicely tell me that my heating plan won't work. But then they are willing to take my money from me. I priced a Grundfos at over $200, then I bought a Bell & Gossett for $79. And a couple of 3/4" solenoid valves. THEN the owner walked in and explained that the GF pump is Bronze and won't corrode. The B&G will last a short time and will corrode. My question for this group is, do I just bite the bullet, and buy the hugely expensive pump, or can I add something to the water to make it less corrosive? (In another forum, the electric car gurus suggest using transmission fluid as a coolant for their electric motor controllers, because it doesn't freeze. I plan to follow that advice for the car. Not sure about the house :-) Would Reverse Osmosis water be less corrosive than potable (tap) water with clouride and flouride etc.? I happen to have an R-O filter available, and could fill my system from it. Anything else? Adding baking soda? (now I am just making wild guesses, but I thought I would ask those who are doing...while I send my friend the Chemist a note too... :-) Thanks alot Seth. I'll post a separate thread with my idea about how to heat water.... |
10-02-11, 10:37 PM | #156 |
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Where does hot water come from ?
Part 2 - Where does hot water come from ?
We are almost finished with an addition that includes 800 SF that needs heat (and cool, seasonally :-). I have some 1500 feet of 1/2" PEX in the floors, and now I need to figure out how to heat the water that will circulate. (NOTE, this post is all about "plan B" - next spring, we start digging to install HDPE in the backyard for GSHP. :-) I live in Passaic, NJ, which can get Darn Cold in the winter. The "main house" is heated with a 20-year old steam boiler that is probably double the capacity needed. (This is based on audit trails from my friend's Steam Manager software that provides Zoning to the boiler On the coldest day, the thing ran about 6 minutes/hour.). My thought was to tap off the main pipe (where a radiator used to tap in), and feed another "radiator zone" that would basically be a pipe with a vent. A copper pipe would be adjacent to this "radiator" to make a heat exchanger. I would pump fluid from a buffer tank past this heat exchanger. Since I have a zone controller in the system, I should be able to turn on and off the radiator so that I don't overheat the PEX. I also bought a couple of 3/4" solenoid valves. I was thinking I could have 2 branches downstream of the pump, one for the heat exchanger and one for the floors. Then it is easy, I pump the water past the heat exchanger until it gets hot, then switch the valves, and pump the water through the floors until the water is cool. Rinse,then Repeat. Has anyone done anything similar? (Have I explained clearly? Long day :-) Have any feedback? Constructive comments? (or like the plumbing supply guys, "feel free to throw away money" :-). Thanks alot. Seth |
10-02-11, 10:45 PM | #157 | |||
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Quote:
Second, did you use oxygen barrier PEX? If you did you are probably ok. Third, do you have other metals in your hydronic circuit? If you have brass, you might have a galvanic situation that could corrode your iron pump. If you have stainless, no problem. If you have oxygen barrier PEX AND no other metals (excepting stainless), you are home free. I think that there is some kind of corrosion inhibitor, but you better verify that. Quote:
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Do more research. Shop somewhere else. -AC_Hacker
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10-15-11, 01:15 PM | #158 |
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PEX layouts...
I just came across these graphics on a website that offers it's design services.
It is interesting because the graphics illustrate the differences in heat distribution resulting from various PEX layouts. Finite element analysis was the method to arrive at the graphics. The pictures say it all: -AC_Hacker
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10-22-11, 05:47 PM | #159 |
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The pictures does give an idea on how it works. It is not accurate though.
The temperature fall is faster the higher delta T, meaning when the difference in temperature of the air and water. This will make the high temperature water drop faster than the lower temperature water. There is also a way to reduce this temperature drop. If you have higher water speed, the water will also have spent less time in the loop, and thus, have lost less energy, giving a more even thermal distribution. That is why you should not have your loops too long, but rather put more loops in a floor in parallel. This part is not shown in the pictures. Obviously, the thermal imaging is faked (computer generated), and there are some things you can do to improve the heat spread. Having aluminium heat spread plates, preferably one that wraps around the tube, will give you a more even heat spread. Ko_deZ |
11-02-11, 07:24 PM | #160 |
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Other benefits and features of the hydronic underfloor heating system include:
pipe flexibility which permits the cabling of pipe through less accessible areas. No risk of fire or flames from a blowtorch. Easier to work with in confined spaces. Corrosion free. No scale build up. Lead free and non toxic. Less noise from water flow and expansion/contraction. Long pipe lengths reduce fittings required. |
Tags |
diy, heat pump, hydronic, pex, radiant |
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