04-09-14, 10:10 PM | #11 |
Supreme EcoRenovator
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,154
Thanks: 14
Thanked 257 Times in 241 Posts
|
Draw it out and I might be able to simplify the system by having pumps be shared between different functions.
__________________
To my surprise, shortly after Naomi Wu gave me a bit of fame for making good use of solar power, Allie Moore got really jealous of her... |
The Following User Says Thank You to NiHaoMike For This Useful Post: | buffalobillpatrick (05-26-14) |
04-11-14, 02:51 PM | #12 |
Master EcoRenovator
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Florissant, Colorado
Posts: 599
Thanks: 814
Thanked 59 Times in 55 Posts
|
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1397245854
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1397245854 |
04-11-14, 05:27 PM | #13 |
Supreme EcoRenovator
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,154
Thanks: 14
Thanked 257 Times in 241 Posts
|
I don't see how the first drawing would work, but the second drawing looks like a reasonable starting point. I'll see what I can do.
__________________
To my surprise, shortly after Naomi Wu gave me a bit of fame for making good use of solar power, Allie Moore got really jealous of her... |
The Following User Says Thank You to NiHaoMike For This Useful Post: | buffalobillpatrick (04-11-14) |
04-11-14, 05:32 PM | #14 |
Master EcoRenovator
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Florissant, Colorado
Posts: 599
Thanks: 814
Thanked 59 Times in 55 Posts
|
I modified #1 from what I found here:
Phc News - Columns: February 2013: Bristol Stickney "Primary loop configuration. Standardize the solar/hydronic piping. A primary loop “flow center” piping configuration allows multiple heat sources to be connected to multiple heat loads and to provide heat directly, to bypass any source or any load or to allow simultaneous operation of any source or load. In past articles, I used a simple primary loop combisystem called “Combi 101” to illustrate these features on a system that includes a bank of solar heat panels, a boiler, a domestic hot water tank and warm floor space heating. - See more at: http://www.phcnews.com/oct_12/solar.php#sthash.8j0sjgv7.dpuf" Last edited by buffalobillpatrick; 04-11-14 at 06:12 PM.. |
04-11-14, 05:41 PM | #15 |
Supreme EcoRenovator
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,154
Thanks: 14
Thanked 257 Times in 241 Posts
|
That would require a lot of changes to make it work with a heat pump and still have bypass mode.
Exactly what modes of operation are you interested in?
__________________
To my surprise, shortly after Naomi Wu gave me a bit of fame for making good use of solar power, Allie Moore got really jealous of her... |
The Following User Says Thank You to NiHaoMike For This Useful Post: | buffalobillpatrick (04-12-14) |
04-11-14, 10:52 PM | #16 |
Master EcoRenovator
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Florissant, Colorado
Posts: 599
Thanks: 814
Thanked 59 Times in 55 Posts
|
Please explain: "bypass mode"
Modes of operation: 1. Solar heats DHW tank if it's output is hot enough (>150*F) 2. Boiler heats DHW tank. 3. Winter, Solar heats Radiant floors directly (not via HP) if > 90*F 4. Winter, Solar heats Thermal Accumulator if > 110*F which provides heat to Radiant floors. 5. Winter, Solar provides heat input to HP Evaporator (35->90*F), HP condenser heats Thermal Accumulator (110*F) which provides heat to Radiant floors. 6. Winter, boiler heats thermal accumulator which provides heat to Radiant floors. Last edited by buffalobillpatrick; 04-12-14 at 12:15 AM.. |
04-12-14, 09:04 AM | #17 |
Supreme EcoRenovator
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,154
Thanks: 14
Thanked 257 Times in 241 Posts
|
"Bypass" is #1, #3 and #4 on your list.
It seems like you can considerably simplify the design by not having the second tank. Since the main tank is like a regular water heater but with a pair of copper tubes running inside it (correct? or is it just one?), you could have DHW running in one of the tubes instead of the tank itself. Then you don't need to worry about bacteria growth since the water would be changed quite rapidly with regular use.
__________________
To my surprise, shortly after Naomi Wu gave me a bit of fame for making good use of solar power, Allie Moore got really jealous of her... |
The Following User Says Thank You to NiHaoMike For This Useful Post: | buffalobillpatrick (05-26-14) |
04-12-14, 12:36 PM | #18 |
Master EcoRenovator
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Florissant, Colorado
Posts: 599
Thanks: 814
Thanked 59 Times in 55 Posts
|
Which tank are you calling "main"?
Neither the DHW tank, nor the Thermal Accumulator have internal HX. One reason why I want at least 50 gal. of 140* DHW is that there will be a soaking tub. Last edited by buffalobillpatrick; 04-12-14 at 12:43 PM.. |
04-12-14, 01:27 PM | #19 |
Supreme EcoRenovator
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 1,154
Thanks: 14
Thanked 257 Times in 241 Posts
|
I don't see why you would need (or want) water that hot for a soaking tub. The main tank is the 120 gallon.
Are the tanks constructed in such a way that it would be reasonably easy to add copper tubing inside? Does the boiler have its own tank or is it a tankless?
__________________
To my surprise, shortly after Naomi Wu gave me a bit of fame for making good use of solar power, Allie Moore got really jealous of her... |
The Following User Says Thank You to NiHaoMike For This Useful Post: | buffalobillpatrick (05-26-14) |
04-12-14, 02:04 PM | #20 |
Master EcoRenovator
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Florissant, Colorado
Posts: 599
Thanks: 814
Thanked 59 Times in 55 Posts
|
"I don't see why you would need (or want) water that hot for a soaking tub. The main tank is the 120 gallon."
Because soaking tub holds 100 gallons. The Thermal Accumulator is no longer used for DHW, it now contains nasty boiler water + it is now kept at lower temp. to allow for higher Eff. when HP is heating it. "Are the tanks constructed in such a way that it would be reasonably easy to add copper tubing inside?" Not Possible. "Does the boiler have its own tank or is it a tankless?" Boiler = CI NG, no tank but weighs 300# & holds several gallons. |
|
|