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Old 09-21-11, 02:29 PM   #1
Phantom
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Default Insulating the water heater/pipes

I am planning on insulating my new gas water heater and hot water pipes but have a few questions. I would like to get the best bang for my buck and do not mind if the time needed to finish the job takes a little longer than other options.

Products I'm looking at:
Pipes:
Armacell Tubolit 3/4 in. x 6 ft. Polyethylene Pipe Wrap Insulation - R2.3 ($1.18) the 1 in is R2.4 (1.28)

Reflectix Double-Sided Reflective Insulation: R-value that range from R-3.7 to R-17 and according to Reflectix PDF the R-value should be R-4. I assume that if I create an air gap around the pipe that it will increase the R-value to at-least 4.5.


Water Heater:
Reflectix Double-Sided Reflective Insulation: R-value should be R-4.5 for the water heater.

Thermwell Products Fiberglass R19 Equivalent Water Heater Blanket - Reviews state its actually R-3.5 ($25.30)

Thermwell Products Fiberglass Water Heater Insulation Blanket - Looks like the same item as above but has a plastic liner and claims an R-10 I'm not sure if this is the same as the above rating. ($21.50)

UltraTouch Denim Insulation Hot Water Heater Blanket - R-6.7 I like this since it is recycled and has itch free instillation, I'm just not sure if fire safety could be an issue. ($28)


The hot water line only runs 12-15ft to the bathroom and 20-25ft to the kitchen. After the first few feet of copper pipe it transitions to galvanized pipe that I might not be able to get pipe insulation large enough locally.

What are everyone's thoughts on the above items and the intended uses?

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Old 09-21-11, 02:56 PM   #2
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The only choices for pipe insulation for me was 1/2" and 3/4". I chose the 3/4" and I've been very happy with it. Here is my install:

http://ecorenovator.org/forum/conser...ter-pipes.html

As for the tank insulation, I also had a limited selection. There was I think an R4 with white plastic outside and an R7 package with reflective foil on the outside. I chose the R7. It seemed to work well but I didn't get to use it long since my water heater started leaking a few months after. According to my wild guess though it did quite a bit (40% reduction in heat loss through the sides), but it was an old heater. The install is here:

http://ecorenovator.org/forum/conser...er-heater.html
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Old 09-21-11, 05:37 PM   #3
herlichka
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The one item that catches my eye is the galvanized steel pipe that you mentioned. I would suggest that if you can you should replace it asap with copper, or pex, whichever you feel more comfortable working with. Old galvanized pipe is frowned upon by most home insurance companies, you may not be covered against damages should the pipe fail. Also, be aware that non mettalic pipes do not function as an earth ground for your electrical systems, usually not a problem in newer homes, but in older homes, with 2-wire, or knob and tube electrical lines there has always been the temptation to bond to the nearest waterline when installing a GFI .
As for the pipe insulation, there are a lot of good choices, but what really makes the project work is the fit and finish, especially around elbows, clamps and so on.
You want to fasten the insulation to the pipes securely so that it would be difficult to accidently pull off; a lot of good work can unravel very quicky!
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Old 09-21-11, 08:43 PM   #4
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The Armacell is favored by solar installers. In my area, it is more expensive than its counterpart, but easy to use.
You can also use the self stick pipe wrap made by Frost King. Try not to have any breaks in the insulation because it tends to unravel unless it is taped.
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Old 09-21-11, 09:22 PM   #5
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If you replace any water pipe with PEX plastic pipe it's easy to slide insulation over the pipes before fastening them in place, that way you never have to split the insulation to get it around the pipe, I replaced a lot of my old iron pipes with PEX because it doesn't pull the heat out of hot water in the same way iron or copper do and because it's a single smooth piece of pipe with no elbows you can use a slightly smaller pipe and get the same flow rate along with getting hot water to tap sooner.
I like the reflectix pipe insulation because you wrap it around, allowing it to fallow odd shape in old plumbing and go around valves.
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Old 09-22-11, 10:19 AM   #6
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I would like to replace the galvanized pipes but I do not have the money to do so now and have no experience brazing copper. I would and need to rerun some of the electrical work since it looks like most of the house is two wire and the grounded ones run to the water pipe, the water pipe is connected to the earth ground that was added when the breaker box was replaced/installed.

What does it take to connect PEX to copper as if I switch the pipes over to this I would go from the tee by the hot water tank on the cold side and just after the tank on the hot side. (After running new three wire electric on that side of the pipes.)
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Old 09-22-11, 12:42 PM   #7
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I did a little excell work to help decide on the pipe insulation but did not include the water heater blanket as I need to measure it to know how much I will need.



I think that I will not go to with FrostKing as they do not list any r-values and have no products on the webpage.
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Old 09-22-11, 04:19 PM   #8
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I used leftover drywall insulation wrapped horizontially and covered with visqueen.
Cheap and easy
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Old 09-22-11, 07:01 PM   #9
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There is a whole range of solderless adapters available, the name "Sharkbite" comes to mind. Home Depot carries a very complete line.
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Old 09-22-11, 08:21 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phantom View Post
What does it take to connect PEX to copper as if I switch the pipes over to this I would go from the tee by the hot water tank on the cold side and just after the tank on the hot side. (After running new three wire electric on that side of the pipes.)
If you YouTube soldering copper pipes I'm sure some good videos will come up, it's pretty easy, there are connections that adapt from whatever size copper right to whatever size PEX you have, the shark bite fittings at Home Dept cost a bit extra but the nice thing about them is they don't require any tools other then a pipe cutter and they don't require soldering skills so replacing one section or run of pipe with them is going to be cheap, plumbing a whole house is going to cost a lot.
like I said, I really like the PEX because it takes less time for hot water to get to the tap, my house is a duplex and the upper kitchen and bath were really bad, hot water to the upper kitchen used to go through over 60 feet of 3/4" iron pipe, taking over two minutes to get hot water and it would cool off as soon as you turned the tap off, I replaced it with a 25 foot section of 1/2" PEX and that is the best part, it's a single piece of pipe from the basement to the tap, no elbows or splices, you run it like electrical wire, snake it around bends.

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