#2 Sanyo 24KHS72 AC/HP Install Project (Oct 2011) - Page 13

pinballlooking · 04-22-16, 12:24 PM

If I was in your climate I would look at
GREE Crown Series 12,000 BTU Single-Zone Ductless Split
It has the
Infinity Heating Down to -20° F
You can control it from your phone is an added bonus.

This one comes with a free line set but does not have heating to -20 it goes to -4
http://www.comfortup.com/gree-terra-...line-set-kit-1

This is the kind I have the 9,000 BTU units I have three of them but they don't go as cold as the Crown systems and they don't have Wi-Fi

All the spec sheets are on their site.
http://www.greecomfort.com/our-products/

WyrTwister · 04-22-16, 12:35 PM

There is a point of diminishing return , some where . As far as SEER numbers . I personally do not know what that point is ?

I have been told it is about 16 SEER on central split systems .

The one you linked to has free freight . Does not appear to have the free line set . Do not know if you can re-use your old line set ?

God bless
Wyr

Xringer · 04-22-16, 09:13 PM

Yeah, that 'Infinity Heating' model sounds like it's the one to have in New England..
Since I'm retired, I might not be using the phone app.. (I stay at home a lot).
I'll have to start reading the manuals.. Get back up to speed.

Might need some new tools..
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NMOYPVG

Xringer · 04-22-16, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WyrTwister

There is a point of diminishing return , some where . As far as SEER numbers . I personally do not know what that point is ?

I have been told it is about 16 SEER on central split systems .

The one you linked to has free freight . Does not appear to have the free line set . Do not know if you can re-use your old line set ?

God bless
Wyr

SEER is just a number to tell you what your electric bill is going to look like..

If you have a 16 SEER, you use more KWH than a 26 SEER..
https://youtu.be/vxu8ZEMCZVg

I might be able to use the old line set, but I'll just save it as a spare.
This one is mostly aluminum and I think a new copper line set might be better..

WyrTwister · 04-22-16, 10:37 PM

What I was trying to say , there is a point of diminishing return on SEER rating .

Higher SEER rating equipment cost more , up front . May be more complicated , making repairs more complicated / costly .

The up side if a higher SEER rating should result in smaller energy cost .

At some point , there should be a SEER rating to optimize return on investment .

I just do not know what that SEER rating turns out to be , with MS's .

I installed both of my MS's using copper lines , cut from 50' rolls & flared with my old flare tool from 35 - 40 years ago . Craftsman , I think . And used Nylog Blue on the flare fittings .

Bought the Armaflex insulation at Johnstone , also . Insulated both lines . Used some left over heater hose from another project as a drain line .

God bless
Wyr

God bless
Wyr

Xringer · 04-22-16, 11:04 PM

It might be better to have a higher SEER unit.. My cost per KW hour has about doubled during the last 5 or 6 years.
It was 11 cents, then got up to 17, went down a bit, then jumped to 22.25 cents per KW hour..
What if it doubles again? 45 or 50 cents? Don't want to be stuck with 15 Seer units..

Heck, buying a GREE Crown MS, might be just like investing in S&W stock..

Plus, we are getting a lot of extra cold and snowy weather these days..
I've had to start buying heating oil again, since we've used the back-up heat so much..

WyrTwister · 04-23-16, 02:55 AM

Valid point . Had not considered cost difference in what you have to pay for electricity . Compared to what we are accustomed to .

Our other heat source is a gas fired furnace . No one uses oil for heat , around here .

When I was a kid , on the farm , we used propane / butane .

God bless
Wyr

Xringer · 04-23-16, 09:20 AM

My memory is going south. 6.5 years ago when I was installing Sanyo #1, the price was
about 20 cents per KWH.. It's gone down and back up a little since then.
What we have been seeing lately, is increases in cost due to colder weather.
Plus we've also been heating the den with the den Sanyo.
Summer cooling cost is stable, but in the winter it's spiking up around $200 (up from $100).

A lot of people here are still using oil. I see the oil deliveries on my street daily.
And the heating system repair vans are pretty common too.
We don't have gas pipe in our area. Down the road in Lexington, almost everyone uses gas..
But, a few still use oil, because they are rich and worry about the danger of using gas.. (Home explodes).
On some streets, the smell of gas leaks is so strong, you can smell it inside your car, as you drive by.

My wife is sold on the -20F systems. She wants to replace both Sanyos.
Even the one that still works!

Oddly, she is starting to think we should have solar PV installed, on the Roof!

WyrTwister · 04-23-16, 10:56 AM

Gas explosions in homes are rare . Fires , on the other hand are probably more common . I expect caused by OLD , junky , worn out furnaces that should have been replaced years ago .

Steam or hot water is common on larger commercial buildings . Schools and smaller commercial buildings are commonly Roof Top Package Units .

Homes are normally split systems .

If you can smell gas leaks driving through a neighborhood , They must have one sorry management at the gas company ! :-(

PV sounds good , but I have never seen it proven that it would pay back . Maybe with tax credits and HIGH electric rates ? And almost 100% DIY installation ?

But , I would have to see the numbers in black and white . Probably also depends on how the utility treats you on power you push back into the system .

Pairing wind and solar might be a good approach .

Ask Pinball , I think he does solar . And drives an EV .

God bless
Wyr

Xringer · 04-23-16, 01:52 PM

I think the heavy oil trucks on residential roads might be breaking gas pipes..

City Maps of Gas Leaks | HEET

Yeah, I think Pinball is right at Zero with his winter heating bill. Lots of PV & MS units..
He's one of those leading-edge guys, setting an example for us.

I did a quick controller check today. It doesn't seem to be running at all.
I was hoping it would be running, but hung on a sensor error.
But the CPU RF signature isn't there. No clock signal is detectable.
(Which I can hear on an AM radio on Sanyo #1).

So, the next step is to see if there is any DC power to the processor on the PCB. And try not to get electrocuted.
If the problem is a blown DC power source, perhaps it can be fixed..

04-22-16, 12:24 PM	#121
pinballlooking Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: SC Posts: 2,923 Thanks: 172 Thanked 564 Times in 463 Posts	If I was in your climate I would look at GREE Crown Series 12,000 BTU Single-Zone Ductless Split It has the Infinity Heating Down to -20° F You can control it from your phone is an added bonus. This one comes with a free line set but does not have heating to -20 it goes to -4 http://www.comfortup.com/gree-terra-...line-set-kit-1 This is the kind I have the 9,000 BTU units I have three of them but they don't go as cold as the Crown systems and they don't have Wi-Fi All the spec sheets are on their site. http://www.greecomfort.com/our-products/ __________________ Current project Aquaponics system , Passive Solar Greenhouse build To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Solar Install 12.5 Kwh- To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Mini Split installs - To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. EV Chevy Volt - To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

04-22-16, 09:13 PM	#123
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	Yeah, that 'Infinity Heating' model sounds like it's the one to have in New England.. Since I'm retired, I might not be using the phone app.. (I stay at home a lot). I'll have to start reading the manuals.. Get back up to speed. Might need some new tools.. http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NMOYPVG __________________ My hobby is installing & trying to repair mini-splits EPA 608 Type 1 Technician Certification ~ 5 lbs or less..

04-22-16, 11:04 PM	#126
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	It might be better to have a higher SEER unit.. My cost per KW hour has about doubled during the last 5 or 6 years. It was 11 cents, then got up to 17, went down a bit, then jumped to 22.25 cents per KW hour.. What if it doubles again? 45 or 50 cents? Don't want to be stuck with 15 Seer units.. Heck, buying a GREE Crown MS, might be just like investing in S&W stock.. Plus, we are getting a lot of extra cold and snowy weather these days.. I've had to start buying heating oil again, since we've used the back-up heat so much.. __________________ My hobby is installing & trying to repair mini-splits EPA 608 Type 1 Technician Certification ~ 5 lbs or less..

04-23-16, 09:20 AM	#128
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	My memory is going south. 6.5 years ago when I was installing Sanyo #1, the price was about 20 cents per KWH.. It's gone down and back up a little since then. What we have been seeing lately, is increases in cost due to colder weather. Plus we've also been heating the den with the den Sanyo. Summer cooling cost is stable, but in the winter it's spiking up around $200 (up from $100). A lot of people here are still using oil. I see the oil deliveries on my street daily. And the heating system repair vans are pretty common too. We don't have gas pipe in our area. Down the road in Lexington, almost everyone uses gas.. But, a few still use oil, because they are rich and worry about the danger of using gas.. (Home explodes). On some streets, the smell of gas leaks is so strong, you can smell it inside your car, as you drive by. My wife is sold on the -20F systems. She wants to replace both Sanyos. Even the one that still works! Oddly, she is starting to think we should have solar PV installed, on the Roof! __________________ My hobby is installing & trying to repair mini-splits EPA 608 Type 1 Technician Certification ~ 5 lbs or less..

04-23-16, 01:52 PM	#130
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	I think the heavy oil trucks on residential roads might be breaking gas pipes.. City Maps of Gas Leaks \| HEET Yeah, I think Pinball is right at Zero with his winter heating bill. Lots of PV & MS units.. He's one of those leading-edge guys, setting an example for us. I did a quick controller check today. It doesn't seem to be running at all. I was hoping it would be running, but hung on a sensor error. But the CPU RF signature isn't there. No clock signal is detectable. (Which I can hear on an AM radio on Sanyo #1). So, the next step is to see if there is any DC power to the processor on the PCB. And try not to get electrocuted. If the problem is a blown DC power source, perhaps it can be fixed.. __________________ My hobby is installing & trying to repair mini-splits EPA 608 Type 1 Technician Certification ~ 5 lbs or less..

04-22-16, 12:35 PM	#122
WyrTwister Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: USA Posts: 543 Thanks: 6 Thanked 44 Times in 38 Posts	There is a point of diminishing return , some where . As far as SEER numbers . I personally do not know what that point is ? I have been told it is about 16 SEER on central split systems . The one you linked to has free freight . Does not appear to have the free line set . Do not know if you can re-use your old line set ? God bless Wyr

04-22-16, 10:37 PM	#125
WyrTwister Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: USA Posts: 543 Thanks: 6 Thanked 44 Times in 38 Posts	What I was trying to say , there is a point of diminishing return on SEER rating . Higher SEER rating equipment cost more , up front . May be more complicated , making repairs more complicated / costly . The up side if a higher SEER rating should result in smaller energy cost . At some point , there should be a SEER rating to optimize return on investment . I just do not know what that SEER rating turns out to be , with MS's . I installed both of my MS's using copper lines , cut from 50' rolls & flared with my old flare tool from 35 - 40 years ago . Craftsman , I think . And used Nylog Blue on the flare fittings . Bought the Armaflex insulation at Johnstone , also . Insulated both lines . Used some left over heater hose from another project as a drain line . God bless Wyr God bless Wyr

04-23-16, 02:55 AM	#127
WyrTwister Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: USA Posts: 543 Thanks: 6 Thanked 44 Times in 38 Posts	Valid point . Had not considered cost difference in what you have to pay for electricity . Compared to what we are accustomed to . Our other heat source is a gas fired furnace . No one uses oil for heat , around here . When I was a kid , on the farm , we used propane / butane . God bless Wyr

04-23-16, 10:56 AM	#129
WyrTwister Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: USA Posts: 543 Thanks: 6 Thanked 44 Times in 38 Posts	Gas explosions in homes are rare . Fires , on the other hand are probably more common . I expect caused by OLD , junky , worn out furnaces that should have been replaced years ago . Steam or hot water is common on larger commercial buildings . Schools and smaller commercial buildings are commonly Roof Top Package Units . Homes are normally split systems . If you can smell gas leaks driving through a neighborhood , They must have one sorry management at the gas company ! :-( PV sounds good , but I have never seen it proven that it would pay back . Maybe with tax credits and HIGH electric rates ? And almost 100% DIY installation ? But , I would have to see the numbers in black and white . Probably also depends on how the utility treats you on power you push back into the system . Pairing wind and solar might be a good approach . Ask Pinball , I think he does solar . And drives an EV . God bless Wyr