Why are GHP so expensive?

Geo NR Gee · 02-28-11, 01:07 PM

What makes Geothermal Heat Pumps so expensive? Yes, I would rather make my own, but I haven't found a complete step by step, DIY for Dummies GHP system book (yet).

The companies must have to charge a lot for their engineering and design? Like this one, 2 Stage Geothermal Heat Pump 3 Ton w/DIY for Horiz Loop - eBay (item 170598905580 end time Mar-05-11 09:22:42 PST)

S-F · 02-28-11, 01:11 PM

Why do Geothermal Systems cost so much? - GreenBuildingTalk - GreenBuildingTalk - Green Building Forums on Insulating Concrete Forms (ICF), Structural Insulated Panels (SIP), Radiant Heating, Geothermal Heat Pumps, Solar Power, Green Construction Pro

Geo NR Gee · 02-28-11, 01:57 PM

I am sorry, I meant the actual unit itself. With what A/C Hacker and others are doing, it would seem that one could make a unit for thousands less. I am a DIY kinda guy too. But the calculations and other areas I am not able to grasp.

Looking at a ready made unit, it really looks like a simple unit. Like this one....

http://www.mcquay.com/mcquaybiz/lite...Cat_1100-5.pdf

S-F · 02-28-11, 02:45 PM

Yeah, that unit looks pretty low-tech.I imagine that AC Hacker's until will probably be more efficient.

AC_Hacker · 02-28-11, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by braebyrn

But the calculations and other areas I am not able to grasp...

Exactly what parts of the calculations are you having trouble with? Maybe I can help...

I'm really trying to make this stuff understandable.

-AC_Hacker

strider3700 · 02-28-11, 07:09 PM

My best guess would be that every commerical model out there needs to be certified safe and that can cost thousands. So since they are relatively low volume items there aren't many unit's to spread that cost across.

AC_Hacker · 02-28-11, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by braebyrn

What makes Geothermal Heat Pumps so expensive?

Part of it is that people are fooled into inaction regarding the 'black-art' of refrigeration technology, and are afraid to take something so mysterious as that on. Replacing brake parts on a car is probably more difficult and certainly more dangerous.

But, I have actually paid the bucks to go to a GSHP training seminar and the focus is on per-installation profits and not on lowering the price of the installations to the point that economy of scale will come into play. It's like the auto industry before Henry Ford came along... cars were handcrafted things that only the elites could afford, same with GSHP today.

I just don't think that certification costs are the hold up.

My secret wish is that people like us will start doing enough of our own GSHP installs to force the industry to make professional installs cheap enough that homeowners would not want to go to the trouble.

I hear that the whole thing can be done in Europe for around $6k. Are they really that much smarter?

In my opinion, there's a very real opportunity for someone to make a huge amount of money and save the planet a huge amount of energy.

There is just no excuse for things to be the way the are.

-AC_Hacker

Geo NR Gee · 02-28-11, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AC_Hacker

In my opinion, there's a very real opportunity for someone to make a huge amount of money and save the planet a huge amount of energy.

There is just no excuse for things to be the way the are.

-AC_Hacker

I agree. Sometimes I feel its like the light bulb syndrome. They knew how to make a light bulb last for years...........

Geo NR Gee · 02-28-11, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strider3700

My best guess would be that every commerical model out there needs to be certified and that can cost thousands. So since they are relatively low volume items there aren't many unit's to spread that cost across.

Makes sense.

okpiddler · 03-05-11, 11:34 PM

Maybe when the Gov't started giving thirty percent tax credit the price went up twenty nine percent. I am with AC there is no excuse. We need to get together and start a factory with smaller units for folks that have smaller homes and try to save energy. Take Drake for example. He is going to be using very little energy if he can get a little unit together. What he needs is not made in any factory that I know of. If I knew anyone around my area who needed one I would help them out for fun. With free labor I could put geo closed loop floor heat in a new home for about 5000$ That is without AC. Zoned, tubing in post tension slab. 2 600' loops of HDPE buried in a 6' deep by 3' wide and 300' long. Bury it before building the house. Zig zag across the lot.

02-28-11, 01:07 PM	#1
Geo NR Gee Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Seattle Posts: 326 Thanks: 109 Thanked 23 Times in 18 Posts	Why are GHP so expensive? What makes Geothermal Heat Pumps so expensive? Yes, I would rather make my own, but I haven't found a complete step by step, DIY for Dummies GHP system book (yet). The companies must have to charge a lot for their engineering and design? Like this one, 2 Stage Geothermal Heat Pump 3 Ton w/DIY for Horiz Loop - eBay (item 170598905580 end time Mar-05-11 09:22:42 PST)

02-28-11, 01:11 PM	#2
S-F You Ain't Me Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Northampton MA Posts: 662 Thanks: 6 Thanked 71 Times in 58 Posts	Why do Geothermal Systems cost so much? - GreenBuildingTalk - GreenBuildingTalk - Green Building Forums on Insulating Concrete Forms (ICF), Structural Insulated Panels (SIP), Radiant Heating, Geothermal Heat Pumps, Solar Power, Green Construction Pro

02-28-11, 01:57 PM	#3
Geo NR Gee Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Seattle Posts: 326 Thanks: 109 Thanked 23 Times in 18 Posts	I am sorry, I meant the actual unit itself. With what A/C Hacker and others are doing, it would seem that one could make a unit for thousands less. I am a DIY kinda guy too. But the calculations and other areas I am not able to grasp. Looking at a ready made unit, it really looks like a simple unit. Like this one.... http://www.mcquay.com/mcquaybiz/lite...Cat_1100-5.pdf

02-28-11, 02:45 PM	#4
S-F You Ain't Me Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Northampton MA Posts: 662 Thanks: 6 Thanked 71 Times in 58 Posts	Yeah, that unit looks pretty low-tech.I imagine that AC Hacker's until will probably be more efficient.

02-28-11, 07:09 PM	#6
strider3700 Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Vancouver Island BC Posts: 745 Thanks: 23 Thanked 37 Times in 30 Posts	My best guess would be that every commerical model out there needs to be certified safe and that can cost thousands. So since they are relatively low volume items there aren't many unit's to spread that cost across.

03-05-11, 11:34 PM	#10
okpiddler Lurking Renovator Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: NE Oklahoma Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Maybe when the Gov't started giving thirty percent tax credit the price went up twenty nine percent. I am with AC there is no excuse. We need to get together and start a factory with smaller units for folks that have smaller homes and try to save energy. Take Drake for example. He is going to be using very little energy if he can get a little unit together. What he needs is not made in any factory that I know of. If I knew anyone around my area who needed one I would help them out for fun. With free labor I could put geo closed loop floor heat in a new home for about 5000$ That is without AC. Zoned, tubing in post tension slab. 2 600' loops of HDPE buried in a 6' deep by 3' wide and 300' long. Bury it before building the house. Zig zag across the lot.