DIY solar/worth the cost? - Page 9

pinballlooking · 11-10-16, 07:08 AM

Have you talked to the owner of the business personally? If not do that today.
Maybe you can get this resolved.

stevehull · 11-10-16, 07:20 AM

Roostre,

I forgot that you are in a snow belt area (roof loading). I can tell you that the additional static load of the proposed PV system is only a few lbs per sq foot (racking, panels, wire and roof attachments). Note that when you are walking on a roof, there can be a load of some 75 lbs per sq ft (each footprint = 75lbs). Just don't stand on one leg!

This PV static load is FAR less than snow load, but the permitting people want to know if the snow loading plus the PV system is excessive.

Bottom line - it is not.

Wish I could write you a letter . . . . .

Steve

Roostre · 11-10-16, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pinballlooking

Have you talked to the owner of the business personally? If not do that today.
Maybe you can get this resolved.

I did on Tuesday. He called the guy he subcontracted and then called me back an hour later. The subcontractor had been ignoring my texts that day. (I have only text him twice in 10 days) About 10PM that night I again text him and asked if there was anything I could do to help expedite the process; including picking up the packages and taking them to the city for him. He finally answered with an apology and then promised it would happen the next day. (Yesterday)

Around 5PM yesterday I asked him if he was able to complete the permitting and no response whatsoever.

I will call the owner again today. I plan to ask him for proof of submission (receipt from the city) and a copy of the plans by noon. If they do not comply I will start the process with Visa to request a refund, which may well end up in court.

Then I will be back at square one and needing a structural engineers stamp.

Roostre · 11-10-16, 12:22 PM

Well, it gets even better!

I finally managed to get the subcontractor to send me the engineering sheets, He was "on his way" to pull the permit. I check it over and he has used the wrong racking for the engineering!!!!

No way this happens before snow falls. Probably no way before the 31st of December. I am so screwed.

Roostre · 11-10-16, 08:10 PM

Just home from work and I just went through the "permit package" that these guys sent me.

It has the system size wrong on the front page title. It says 7.42kw
They have the wrong panels and a different size 265w vs. the 270w it should be.
The racking is wrong as I posted above.

There is no letter from a structural engineer.

It looks like copy and paste or some seriously shoddy work. The guy who sent them says " I just turn in what I'm given." He says the owner gave him the wrong information. The only thing that is right is the inverter.

He says he already turned it in to the city and they told him about a 17 day wait. Not sure if this is 17 business days or calendar, but either way its into December before they look at it. If it has to be fixed (which no letter from a structural engineer is what I see as an issue) it will get kicked back into January and I lose the tax credit.

I talked to another company today about this. They told me that if I can get them the information quickly they can get the engineering letter and completed package by November 18th.

So here I sit trying to decide if I ride this fiasco out or cancel the deal and pay this other guy $550 and re-submit the correct information on the 18th????

We really, really need the tax credit this year.

Good news is that this is a first world problem and I know we are blessed that this is the biggest problem in our lives. I'm grateful to be in this position, even if it has been nerve wracking at times.

where2 · 11-10-16, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roostre

I finally managed to get the subcontractor to send me the engineering sheets, He was "on his way" to pull the permit. I check it over and he has used the wrong racking for the engineering!!!!

Better to find out the drawings are flawed before they are filed, than after the permit was pulled...

You need a PE familiar with ASCE 7-05. The phone book should have several. Some will attempt to tell you you are crazy want to do a PV self-install. I had one of those, and I will never call that PE back for any future work, period. I also followed up with my friend the local architect who gave me that PE's number.

Like you, I'm a doer. Many of the PE drawings in my permitting set were actually drawn by me. Much of my livelihood is made using AutoCAD, yet my PE sketches were mainly hand drawn sketches by me showing precisely how the (tile hook) mounts would attach to the trusses in the attic without directly bolting through my metal roof tiles. My PE didn't need to draw these for me, he simply needed to review and approve them. Rather than draw my graphical sketches, he needed to tell me what size and length bolts met the uplift load calculations he ran, and how many total mounts were necessary to meet his mathematical criteria. My PE drawings have numerous pages of mathematical calculations showing the area of the array, and the uplift created by this giant wing bolted to my roof. The PE I used was already familiar with my house from previous structural upgrades to mitigate potential wind damage. I believe I even did some of those drawings for him when we were moving windows in the second floor walls and installing impact windows...

Roostre · 11-11-16, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by where2

Better to find out the drawings are flawed before they are filed, than after the permit was pulled...

Like you, I'm a doer. Many of the PE drawings in my permitting set were actually drawn by me.

I don't have as much experience as you do, but I was floored that they actually used the quicky CAD drawing I sent them. I certainly could have produced a higher quality set of electrical and layouts...

The owner has reached out and he believes that the details aren't important as long as we get the electrical, layout, and loading correct. He says (in writing) that he will re-engineer it on his dime if that happens and make sure that it gets done prior to years end.

His statements and a long text discussion with the installer last night has calmed my fears a bit. Getting it in writing helps. It boiled down to a miscommunication from Party A to Party B, then multiplied by not sending me a "proof" or something before going to the city. Miscommunication seems to be a root cause of 99% of the issues in life. Hopefully they learn something from the issue.

terrybarnes · 11-24-16, 06:39 AM

In my opinion if you want to get a rough estimate of a solar panel cost it might be depend upon your location or the avg. electrical consumption in your area. If you want to know the accurate cost then have a look to your power bills and find the avg. kWh per month of your house uses.

Roostre · 11-24-16, 07:26 AM

Yeah, for sure Terry.

My permit was finally processed by the city and denied due to no "wet" engineering stamp (Tuesday). I'm told by the solar company that did my package it will be done and turned back in Wednesday.

Snowed last night, so installation is looking to be a dangerous endeavor now.

wilsonsmith · 11-27-16, 10:47 PM

As of early 2016, most U.S homeowners are paying $3 to $4 per watt to install a solar panel system, and the average cost per watt in the U.S. is $3.57 per watt. Using the national average for pv system size at 5 kW (or 5000 watts), the average cost of solar: $12,500 (after the Federal ITC discount).

That’s 12 percent lower than it was a year ago, and solar panel system costs are continuing to fall. However, to really understand what a single solar panel will cost and what a complete solar system will cost, it’s important to compare prices quoted to homeowners in your area – total costs can vary depending on the state that you live in.

11-10-16, 07:08 AM	#81
pinballlooking Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: SC Posts: 2,923 Thanks: 172 Thanked 564 Times in 463 Posts	Have you talked to the owner of the business personally? If not do that today. Maybe you can get this resolved. __________________ Current project Aquaponics system , Passive Solar Greenhouse build To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Solar Install 12.5 Kwh- To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Mini Split installs - To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. EV Chevy Volt - To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

11-10-16, 07:20 AM	#82
stevehull Steve Hull Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: hilly, tree covered Arcadia, OK USA Posts: 826 Thanks: 241 Thanked 165 Times in 123 Posts	Roostre, I forgot that you are in a snow belt area (roof loading). I can tell you that the additional static load of the proposed PV system is only a few lbs per sq foot (racking, panels, wire and roof attachments). Note that when you are walking on a roof, there can be a load of some 75 lbs per sq ft (each footprint = 75lbs). Just don't stand on one leg! This PV static load is FAR less than snow load, but the permitting people want to know if the snow loading plus the PV system is excessive. Bottom line - it is not. Wish I could write you a letter . . . . . Steve __________________ consulting on geothermal heating/cooling & rational energy use since 1990

11-27-16, 10:47 PM	#90
wilsonsmith Banned Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: USA Posts: 3 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	How Much Do Solar Panels Cost? As of early 2016, most U.S homeowners are paying $3 to $4 per watt to install a solar panel system, and the average cost per watt in the U.S. is $3.57 per watt. Using the national average for pv system size at 5 kW (or 5000 watts), the average cost of solar: $12,500 (after the Federal ITC discount). That’s 12 percent lower than it was a year ago, and solar panel system costs are continuing to fall. However, to really understand what a single solar panel will cost and what a complete solar system will cost, it’s important to compare prices quoted to homeowners in your area – total costs can vary depending on the state that you live in.

11-10-16, 12:22 PM	#84
Roostre EcoLearner Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Rocky Mtns Posts: 113 Thanks: 107 Thanked 26 Times in 19 Posts	Well, it gets even better! I finally managed to get the subcontractor to send me the engineering sheets, He was "on his way" to pull the permit. I check it over and he has used the wrong racking for the engineering!!!! No way this happens before snow falls. Probably no way before the 31st of December. I am so screwed.

11-10-16, 08:10 PM	#85
Roostre EcoLearner Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Rocky Mtns Posts: 113 Thanks: 107 Thanked 26 Times in 19 Posts	Just home from work and I just went through the "permit package" that these guys sent me. It has the system size wrong on the front page title. It says 7.42kw They have the wrong panels and a different size 265w vs. the 270w it should be. The racking is wrong as I posted above. There is no letter from a structural engineer. It looks like copy and paste or some seriously shoddy work. The guy who sent them says " I just turn in what I'm given." He says the owner gave him the wrong information. The only thing that is right is the inverter. He says he already turned it in to the city and they told him about a 17 day wait. Not sure if this is 17 business days or calendar, but either way its into December before they look at it. If it has to be fixed (which no letter from a structural engineer is what I see as an issue) it will get kicked back into January and I lose the tax credit. I talked to another company today about this. They told me that if I can get them the information quickly they can get the engineering letter and completed package by November 18th. So here I sit trying to decide if I ride this fiasco out or cancel the deal and pay this other guy $550 and re-submit the correct information on the 18th???? We really, really need the tax credit this year. Good news is that this is a first world problem and I know we are blessed that this is the biggest problem in our lives. I'm grateful to be in this position, even if it has been nerve wracking at times.

11-24-16, 06:39 AM	#88
terrybarnes Lurking Renovator Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: Canada Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	In my opinion if you want to get a rough estimate of a solar panel cost it might be depend upon your location or the avg. electrical consumption in your area. If you want to know the accurate cost then have a look to your power bills and find the avg. kWh per month of your house uses.

11-24-16, 07:26 AM	#89
Roostre EcoLearner Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Rocky Mtns Posts: 113 Thanks: 107 Thanked 26 Times in 19 Posts	Yeah, for sure Terry. My permit was finally processed by the city and denied due to no "wet" engineering stamp (Tuesday). I'm told by the solar company that did my package it will be done and turned back in Wednesday. Snowed last night, so installation is looking to be a dangerous endeavor now.