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Old 01-20-18, 09:55 AM   #1
slopecarver
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Default Source for R410A flared unions?

I'm installing my own mini-split consisting of a Fujitsu wall mount unit on an interior wall. The unit didn't come with a short line to pass through the wall so I need to cut a small section of the lineset to install the wall unit and make the a union connection in the basement to the longer line that will run outside. I don't think I can run a continuous line.

R410a requires special flared unions but I can't fine a supplier for the unions,or at least not union that are specifically called out for R410a use. Everything I find is for fuel gas. Can anyone here help me out?

A professional forum would blast a common homeowner but I just don't trust/can't afford the hacks around here.

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Old 01-20-18, 06:38 PM   #2
oil pan 4
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I can't find any difference between the brass natural gas fittings and hvac ones.
I have used them on my 2 ton split.
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Old 01-22-18, 10:42 AM   #3
bpatton
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Default Flares are a nightmare

From personal experience you don't want to do that.... Making flares for 410a is a sort of art form and they have a high probability of leaking due to the high pressures involved.
I did the same thing you want to do with a mini split and now I'm going to have to go back and braze the lineset so I can have some peace of mind.
If you are going to braze, nitrogen is a MUST. You have to flow some nitrogen through the lines so that carbon doesn't build up inside of the lineset with the high temperatures. You can braze with a map gas torch if you have it, just use a stick of Sil-Fos for the braze and you should be good.
The best advice I have on flares is to make sure to deburr the inside of the copper before you flare it and then use a dab of Nylog flare sealer on the seat of the flare and on the threads too.

Typically in the HVAC world they dont use "unions" like they do in plumbing, Its a male flare stub that's brazed onto one end or the other of the line set. You can get brass plumbing unions at hardware stores that have male ends on both sides but that increases the possibility of leaks when there is now four flares in that joint instead of just two (one per line)

Last edited by bpatton; 01-23-18 at 12:40 AM..
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Old 01-22-18, 03:43 PM   #4
jeff5may
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Making flare fittings that don't leak is a learned skill. Even with the super expensive, can't go wrong tool, it is easy to make a fitting that leaks. After a few dozen, the process gets easier through trial and error. For the car guys, it's almost exactly like brake lines. If you're skittish about how strong the flare fittings are, make up a double flare. The tool is available in the loaner tool program at your favorite local auto parts store. The little dies that are used to make the double flare are used to set the stick out of the tubing.

If you really want the right tool, the new super pro ones have an eccentric forming cone on them that rolls the end of the tube instead of stamping it. They have a torque clutch on the twisty knob quill that prevents over tightening the cone. They're available at the same supply houses that sell the refrigeration flare nuts and fittings: Johnstone supply, the Parker store (AKA air hydro power), United, etc. Same place you go to buy refrigerant. Beware of sticker shock! It's almost cheaper to call a tech out to do the job.

Fwiw, pretty much all flare tools are 45 degrees. The only ones that are not are for super custom hydraulic lines for steel. The only steel pipes that are used in refrigeration are in ammonia chillers.

Last edited by jeff5may; 01-23-18 at 08:13 AM..
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Old 01-23-18, 12:38 AM   #5
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Thanks Jeff, I'll correct my previous post with that information on the flare angles, I seem to have been misinformed.
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Old 01-25-18, 08:08 AM   #6
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Thanks all for the advice. I have faith in my ability to do flares with the proper HVAC tools, I just needed a supplier for the high pressure fittings. McMaster-Carr has them of all places: https://www.mcmaster.com/#catalog/124/218/

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