Sanyo 24KHS72 AC/HP DIY install project - Page 44

Xringer · 10-04-11, 10:26 AM

Dang, they are even line-set kits are out of stock!
DHS0006 - 1/4 X 5/8 Insulated Lineset (OUT OF STOCK)

Being out of stock for the 24KHS72 is normal for them.
The stuff comes in on a slow boat from China..

The drain end of my tube is hanging in the air, about 18" off the ground.
Just to make it a little harder for bugs to get to it.

I may push some stainless steel mesh up into it one of these days.
That will keep out the bugs and let the water flow down..

Xringer · 10-05-11, 07:49 AM

I found some line-sets on Ebay. The prices aren't too far out of line..
15 ft. Mini Split A/C Connection Line Set 1/4" X 5/8" for all refrigerants | eBay

His store is at: maximmarket2001 | eBay

I've spoken to the guy who runs the store, David (847)373-0320
and he handles Haier Mini-Splits and can provide a wide range of line sets. (up to 90 feet).

RKA · 10-07-11, 08:38 AM

Well, I gave up on the condensate tube and bought a 160 ft roll of Airtec DHQ16 (5/8" or 16mm UV resistant). The prices incl shipping costs people were asking were crazy. So I'll just pass on my "group buy" at cost + actual shipping to anyone that needs it.

Ended up with a 2.5" diameter wall sleeve...that's the best I could find. Model number commonly used for it is FPS-65 if you do a google search. Should be about $8 plus shipping give or take.
The mini split is getting delivered today. I can start working on layout today, but that's it. Still hunting and pecking for tools and such. The Robinair pump seems adequate, but you can't get parts for it. Anything that is rebuildable isn't cheap. No middle ground that I can see.

Xringer · 10-07-11, 08:47 AM

You should start up a DIY build thread.. I noticed that my drain Sanyo hose
(now hoses, since I own two units) came with an adapter.
I guess so a larger hose size could be used. Didn't use it before,
But I might use one this time..

RKA · 10-07-11, 09:13 AM

That was the plan after I had done more research and acquired everything I needed. Right now I'm still in google-land trying to figure out what's what. I get myself lost sometimes. Found a vac gauge for under $200 that's extremely accurate with very high resolution. Only problem is I found a lot of HVAC guys saying it drove them crazy because now they would see movement. The issue was that movement seemed to be more related to the manifolds and hoses they were using. Using the best quality hoses and a high quality manifold gets expensive. If your equipment can reliably hold ultra low vac levels, only then will you know whether the system as moisture free as it can be.

Anyway, I want to get a little further down the road before I start compiling the info. *edit* Just realized we can edit the posts. As long as I can do that indefinitely, I can consolidate and maintain all the info into the first post in the thread and discussion can follow below. *doh*

Oh, that adapter, I'm guessing it might be to adapt the metric output to standard sized hoses. The company you bought the mini split from supplied you with an Airtec hose that should connect directly to the Sanyo without the use of an adapter, so I don't think you need it. But for those that are buying 1/2" vinyl hose from home depot, that adapter would probably come in handy. Nice gesture on Sanyo's part.

AC_Hacker · 10-07-11, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RKA

...movement seemed to be more related to the manifolds and hoses they were using. Using the best quality hoses and a high quality manifold gets expensive.

Try using soft copper tubing for your center hose.

Get some female 1/4" flare fittings for each end and flare your tube.

...no leaks, cheap.

-AC_Hacker

Xringer · 10-07-11, 01:54 PM

2.5" diameter wall sleeve ?? That sounds kinda small to me.
What size line set are you going to be using? With the insulation, those things are bulky!

If you think it's going to be real tight (like mine was), install your tube with a foot of 1/4" plastic tube inside. (Don't use soft tube).
So if you compress the drain tube too much, it won't be pinched off and send a flood down your wall.

Don't worry too much about a small ID, since the water output is at a very low rate..
A 1/4" OD line could handle the flow easily..

RKA · 10-11-11, 02:11 PM

Sorry, fell off the map. I've ordered the lineset covers, hole saw and a couple other things. Scored a deal on a brand new vac pump off CL this weekend. now working on vac gauge, manifold, hoses and possibly valve core removers and nitrogen purge equipment. When the wall sleeve arrives I'll dry fit all the bits into it and see where I stand. I think it will be okay. The suction line is 1 3/8" total and the condensate is 5/8". I'm assuming the factory lines coming out of the indoor unit have 3/8" insulation. That's an even two inches with room on either side for the liquid line and wires. The hardest part will be the bend into and out of the sleeve, and if it comes to it, the insulation does have some give and hopefully it does give more than the drain line or I'll have to take your suggestion. Whatever it is, I looked long and hard for a larger wall sleeve and finally found a rectangular one today...a bit too late. So lets see if I can make do with this.

On the copper pipe, that's a good idea if you're connecting direct, but if you are using a manifold to draw vacuum on both sides of the system (recommended), all three hoses should be capable of sustaining ultra low vacuums if you plan to leave it overnight to monitor for stable vacuum. I guess if you pressure test with nitrogen and it holds all you care about is getting to 200 microns and not necessarily about staying there, in which case hose permeability is not an issue?

Xringer · 10-11-11, 08:48 PM

If you look at the way a flare connection is assembled, it's design
allows for a vacuum to really suck the tubing flare down on the cone.
That makes for a very tight seal.

While testing with my test line-set, during my repair project,
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/geothe...html#post16037

I vacuumed out the line-set many times (with both Sanyo valves closed) and removed the test line-set later.
A few times, when I loosened the 5/8" flare nut, there was no hiss of air rushing in.
I had to pull the 5/8" tube off the cone, before the air rushed in..

That tells me that long duration vacuum testing on a line set that can get down under 200 microns is not very useful.
IMHO, If you can get down to <200 and maintain that with the pump running, 10 or 20 minutes (during warm weather)
should remove all the moisture from the line set.

So, looking at the flare connection design with 400 PSI of nitrogen inside the line set,
then you need tight flare nuts! That nut becomes very important.
The lack of any small defect on the mating face of the flare or cone become very important.

The nitrogen pressure test is more important! It simulates real world conditions. Pressure inside the line-set.

My only small worry is putting too much pressure in the line set, which might possibly
force nitrogen into one of the closed valves and into the refrigerant.

AC_Hacker · 10-11-11, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xringer

My only small worry is putting too much pressure in the line set, which might possibly force nitrogen into one of the closed valves and into the refrigerant.

The nitrogen is dry and essentially inert.

-AC_Hacker

10-05-11, 07:49 AM	#432
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	I found some line-sets on Ebay. The prices aren't too far out of line.. 15 ft. Mini Split A/C Connection Line Set 1/4" X 5/8" for all refrigerants \| eBay His store is at: maximmarket2001 \| eBay I've spoken to the guy who runs the store, David (847)373-0320 and he handles Haier Mini-Splits and can provide a wide range of line sets. (up to 90 feet). Last edited by Xringer; 10-05-11 at 02:20 PM.. Reason: contact info

10-07-11, 09:13 AM	#435
RKA Lurking Renovator Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 27 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	That was the plan after I had done more research and acquired everything I needed. Right now I'm still in google-land trying to figure out what's what. I get myself lost sometimes. Found a vac gauge for under $200 that's extremely accurate with very high resolution. Only problem is I found a lot of HVAC guys saying it drove them crazy because now they would see movement. The issue was that movement seemed to be more related to the manifolds and hoses they were using. Using the best quality hoses and a high quality manifold gets expensive. If your equipment can reliably hold ultra low vac levels, only then will you know whether the system as moisture free as it can be. Anyway, I want to get a little further down the road before I start compiling the info. edit Just realized we can edit the posts. As long as I can do that indefinitely, I can consolidate and maintain all the info into the first post in the thread and discussion can follow below. doh Oh, that adapter, I'm guessing it might be to adapt the metric output to standard sized hoses. The company you bought the mini split from supplied you with an Airtec hose that should connect directly to the Sanyo without the use of an adapter, so I don't think you need it. But for those that are buying 1/2" vinyl hose from home depot, that adapter would probably come in handy. Nice gesture on Sanyo's part. Last edited by RKA; 10-07-11 at 09:17 AM..

10-04-11, 10:26 AM	#431
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	Dang, they are even line-set kits are out of stock! DHS0006 - 1/4 X 5/8 Insulated Lineset (OUT OF STOCK) Being out of stock for the 24KHS72 is normal for them. The stuff comes in on a slow boat from China.. The drain end of my tube is hanging in the air, about 18" off the ground. Just to make it a little harder for bugs to get to it. I may push some stainless steel mesh up into it one of these days. That will keep out the bugs and let the water flow down..

10-07-11, 08:38 AM	#433
RKA Lurking Renovator Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 27 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Well, I gave up on the condensate tube and bought a 160 ft roll of Airtec DHQ16 (5/8" or 16mm UV resistant). The prices incl shipping costs people were asking were crazy. So I'll just pass on my "group buy" at cost + actual shipping to anyone that needs it. Ended up with a 2.5" diameter wall sleeve...that's the best I could find. Model number commonly used for it is FPS-65 if you do a google search. Should be about $8 plus shipping give or take. The mini split is getting delivered today. I can start working on layout today, but that's it. Still hunting and pecking for tools and such. The Robinair pump seems adequate, but you can't get parts for it. Anything that is rebuildable isn't cheap. No middle ground that I can see.

10-07-11, 08:47 AM	#434
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	You should start up a DIY build thread.. I noticed that my drain Sanyo hose (now hoses, since I own two units) came with an adapter. I guess so a larger hose size could be used. Didn't use it before, But I might use one this time..

10-07-11, 01:54 PM	#437
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	2.5" diameter wall sleeve ?? That sounds kinda small to me. What size line set are you going to be using? With the insulation, those things are bulky! If you think it's going to be real tight (like mine was), install your tube with a foot of 1/4" plastic tube inside. (Don't use soft tube). So if you compress the drain tube too much, it won't be pinched off and send a flood down your wall. Don't worry too much about a small ID, since the water output is at a very low rate.. A 1/4" OD line could handle the flow easily..

10-11-11, 02:11 PM	#438
RKA Lurking Renovator Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 27 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Sorry, fell off the map. I've ordered the lineset covers, hole saw and a couple other things. Scored a deal on a brand new vac pump off CL this weekend. now working on vac gauge, manifold, hoses and possibly valve core removers and nitrogen purge equipment. When the wall sleeve arrives I'll dry fit all the bits into it and see where I stand. I think it will be okay. The suction line is 1 3/8" total and the condensate is 5/8". I'm assuming the factory lines coming out of the indoor unit have 3/8" insulation. That's an even two inches with room on either side for the liquid line and wires. The hardest part will be the bend into and out of the sleeve, and if it comes to it, the insulation does have some give and hopefully it does give more than the drain line or I'll have to take your suggestion. Whatever it is, I looked long and hard for a larger wall sleeve and finally found a rectangular one today...a bit too late. So lets see if I can make do with this. On the copper pipe, that's a good idea if you're connecting direct, but if you are using a manifold to draw vacuum on both sides of the system (recommended), all three hoses should be capable of sustaining ultra low vacuums if you plan to leave it overnight to monitor for stable vacuum. I guess if you pressure test with nitrogen and it holds all you care about is getting to 200 microns and not necessarily about staying there, in which case hose permeability is not an issue?

10-11-11, 08:48 PM	#439
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	If you look at the way a flare connection is assembled, it's design allows for a vacuum to really suck the tubing flare down on the cone. That makes for a very tight seal. While testing with my test line-set, during my repair project, http://ecorenovator.org/forum/geothe...html#post16037 I vacuumed out the line-set many times (with both Sanyo valves closed) and removed the test line-set later. A few times, when I loosened the 5/8" flare nut, there was no hiss of air rushing in. I had to pull the 5/8" tube off the cone, before the air rushed in.. That tells me that long duration vacuum testing on a line set that can get down under 200 microns is not very useful. IMHO, If you can get down to <200 and maintain that with the pump running, 10 or 20 minutes (during warm weather) should remove all the moisture from the line set. So, looking at the flare connection design with 400 PSI of nitrogen inside the line set, then you need tight flare nuts! That nut becomes very important. The lack of any small defect on the mating face of the flare or cone become very important. The nitrogen pressure test is more important! It simulates real world conditions. Pressure inside the line-set. My only small worry is putting too much pressure in the line set, which might possibly force nitrogen into one of the closed valves and into the refrigerant.