Do you need an extra outlet for ice melt wires on the roof?

Xringer · 09-13-11, 07:15 PM

Lowes has (metal) electrical box Extenders. You just pull off your out door light,
and place an Extender box under the lamp fixture..
(It's a box with no top or bottom, comes with two very long screws).
It has 1/2" threaded holes in the sides, where you can connect up another box.

I used some of that waterproof flexible conduit (left over from Sanyo install)
to connect a second box. (also metal).
I put a GFI outlet in that box and added a water resistant cover on top.

Then I added 400w of zig-zag heater wires to the north east side roof of my den..

Last winter, we had three feet of snow back there. It created a big ice dam,
(1st time since we added the den 25 years ago) and we got water..

This was before it got really deep up there..

The plan is to leave the GTI in reset-off mode until the snow starts flying.
Then reset it and use the indoor switch to control the heater wire..

And to think, I was gonna use an old extension cord..

I was thinking of using an X-10 GFI outlet, but I don't know if they make them.?.

A heavy duty X10 appliance module is too big for the box, unless I can come
up with a small right-angle three pong AC plug for the heater wire..

Ryland · 09-14-11, 12:00 AM

On one of my out door lights I wanted an outlet for christmas lights to light the porch instead of the single bulb, so I added an outlet that has a three way switch, flipping the switch switches between the regular bulb and the outlet so when I turn on the switch that is inside the house that normally controls the light one or the other will come on, if you need more outlets you can always get a out door outlet box that is designed for two duplex outlets, giving you a total of 4 plugs.
I'm also of course a big fan of the twist timer switches, turn it on and forget about it because it will turn it's self off!

herlichka · 09-14-11, 06:34 AM

I see in Xringer's top photo that there is a "drip loop" in the cord under the receptacle. This is so important, as well as keeping all connections dry and away from the flow of the melting snow. These can be frustrating installations in that wet connections will repeatedly cause the GFI"s to trip, and out of frustration some people will remove the GFI and install a non-protected receptacle (I've seen it several times). This is so dangerous, in that there is the potential to energise metal eaves trough, aluminum siding and so on. An aluminum ladder against energised eaves trough could prove fatal!
I went to one house to clean the eaves trough, and the guy had a yellow 16/2, lawnmower cord running from the convenience receptacle (non GFI) beside the panel in the garage, out the door and up the downspout to the heating cables on the roof. The plugs were laying in the trough in the water and wet leaves. This was an accident waiting to happen! His explanation was that when the cables were plugged into the GFI protected receptacle under the eaves, his Christmas lights wouldn't stay on!!

Xringer · 09-14-11, 07:34 AM

That drip-loop was emphasized in the heating wire install manual...

Xringer · 09-14-11, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryland

On one of my out door lights I wanted an outlet for christmas lights to light the porch instead of the single bulb, so I added an outlet that has a three way switch, flipping the switch switches between the regular bulb and the outlet so when I turn on the switch that is inside the house that normally controls the light one or the other will come on, if you need more outlets you can always get a out door outlet box that is designed for two duplex outlets, giving you a total of 4 plugs.
I'm also of course a big fan of the twist timer switches, turn it on and forget about it because it will turn it's self off!

I looked at the idea of running another AC line up to that area,
but there was no easy way to snake a wire up inside the den wall
from the main house. Too much stuff in the way.

I have one of those twist timers running my bathroom exhaust fan,
and really like it. (After seeing them in hotels for 30 years)..
I think maybe I'll look for another 30 minute twist timer
for the fan in the kitchen too..

09-13-11, 07:15 PM	#1
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	Do you need an extra outlet for ice melt wires on the roof? Lowes has (metal) electrical box Extenders. You just pull off your out door light, and place an Extender box under the lamp fixture.. (It's a box with no top or bottom, comes with two very long screws). It has 1/2" threaded holes in the sides, where you can connect up another box. I used some of that waterproof flexible conduit (left over from Sanyo install) to connect a second box. (also metal). I put a GFI outlet in that box and added a water resistant cover on top. Then I added 400w of zig-zag heater wires to the north east side roof of my den.. Last winter, we had three feet of snow back there. It created a big ice dam, (1st time since we added the den 25 years ago) and we got water.. This was before it got really deep up there.. The plan is to leave the GTI in reset-off mode until the snow starts flying. Then reset it and use the indoor switch to control the heater wire.. And to think, I was gonna use an old extension cord.. I was thinking of using an X-10 GFI outlet, but I don't know if they make them.?. A heavy duty X10 appliance module is too big for the box, unless I can come up with a small right-angle three pong AC plug for the heater wire.. Last edited by Xringer; 09-13-11 at 07:20 PM..

09-14-11, 12:00 AM	#2
Ryland Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Western Wisconsin. Posts: 913 Thanks: 127 Thanked 82 Times in 71 Posts	On one of my out door lights I wanted an outlet for christmas lights to light the porch instead of the single bulb, so I added an outlet that has a three way switch, flipping the switch switches between the regular bulb and the outlet so when I turn on the switch that is inside the house that normally controls the light one or the other will come on, if you need more outlets you can always get a out door outlet box that is designed for two duplex outlets, giving you a total of 4 plugs. I'm also of course a big fan of the twist timer switches, turn it on and forget about it because it will turn it's self off!

09-14-11, 06:34 AM	#3
herlichka Apprentice EcoRenovator Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Simcoe County, Ontario, Canada Posts: 102 Thanks: 11 Thanked 15 Times in 10 Posts	I see in Xringer's top photo that there is a "drip loop" in the cord under the receptacle. This is so important, as well as keeping all connections dry and away from the flow of the melting snow. These can be frustrating installations in that wet connections will repeatedly cause the GFI"s to trip, and out of frustration some people will remove the GFI and install a non-protected receptacle (I've seen it several times). This is so dangerous, in that there is the potential to energise metal eaves trough, aluminum siding and so on. An aluminum ladder against energised eaves trough could prove fatal! I went to one house to clean the eaves trough, and the guy had a yellow 16/2, lawnmower cord running from the convenience receptacle (non GFI) beside the panel in the garage, out the door and up the downspout to the heating cables on the roof. The plugs were laying in the trough in the water and wet leaves. This was an accident waiting to happen! His explanation was that when the cables were plugged into the GFI protected receptacle under the eaves, his Christmas lights wouldn't stay on!!

09-14-11, 07:34 AM	#4
Xringer Lex Parsimoniae Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Woburn, MA Posts: 4,918 Thanks: 114 Thanked 250 Times in 230 Posts	That drip-loop was emphasized in the heating wire install manual...