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Old 03-01-16, 05:41 PM   #21
Mobile Master Tech
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One thing to remember about any form of grid-tie: your system has to conform to their specs and inspected to make sure it does, plus it may not save you anything depending on your utility's policy.

I have Jackson EMC. They charge an extra $10/mo for net metering, but only pay you "avoided energy cost" for what you generate, which is basically the cost of the fuel burned to produce it plus transmission losses. In the summer afternoons on a time of use rate, I would pay 35c/kwh to use electricity from them, but they would pay me only 3 or 4 cents per kwh to buy electricity from me. Unless I sell them more than 250kwh or so, it doesn't even offset the metering charge.

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Old 03-01-16, 05:47 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mobile Master Tech View Post
One thing to remember about any form of grid-tie: your system has to conform to their specs and inspected to make sure it does, plus it may not save you anything depending on your utility's policy.

I have Jackson EMC. They charge an extra $10/mo for net metering, but only pay you "avoided energy cost" for what you generate, which is basically the cost of the fuel burned to produce it plus transmission losses. In the summer afternoons on a time of use rate, I would pay 35c/kwh to use electricity from them, but they would pay me only 3 or 4 cents per kwh to buy electricity from me. Unless I sell them more than 250kwh or so, it doesn't even offset the metering charge.
That is some very anti solar policies.
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Old 03-01-16, 07:43 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mobile Master Tech View Post
I have Jackson EMC. They charge an extra $10/mo for net metering, but only pay you "avoided energy cost" for what you generate, which is basically the cost of the fuel burned to produce it plus transmission losses. In the summer afternoons on a time of use rate, I would pay 35c/kwh to use electricity from them, but they would pay me only 3 or 4 cents per kwh to buy electricity from me. Unless I sell them more than 250kwh or so, it doesn't even offset the metering charge.
Just screaming for some guerrilla solar....
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Old 03-02-16, 07:15 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mobile Master Tech View Post
One thing to remember about any form of grid-tie: your system has to conform to their specs and inspected to make sure it does, plus it may not save you anything depending on your utility's policy.

I have Jackson EMC. They charge an extra $10/mo for net metering, but only pay you "avoided energy cost" for what you generate, which is basically the cost of the fuel burned to produce it plus transmission losses. In the summer afternoons on a time of use rate, I would pay 35c/kwh to use electricity from them, but they would pay me only 3 or 4 cents per kwh to buy electricity from me. Unless I sell them more than 250kwh or so, it doesn't even offset the metering charge.
I have a rural coop for my grid. Very good people. I just went to a meeting last week because they have to raise their rates.

Here's what's happening. Because of low solar rates lots of people are now considering PV. (OK oil prices are falling but that won't last forever and when they go up again Alternates will crush them.) What I call single point energy corporations don't want to let go of the strangle hold on energy, PV is a big threat to them because it's harder to monopolize. It is however good for everyone else and the planet. (The Koch brothers aren't concerned about the planet, by the way...) Any how, these corporations are sitting in their board rooms trying to figure how to keep monopolizing energy so they are coming up with all these schemes and deterrents to stop us from going solar. Around here they are now trying to lease land for PV arrays, their telling the poor people here that they are going to get $1k a month per acre. Problem is when you read the small print you get what the people who lease their land for fracking got - next to zip!

So to keep people from installing PV they're doing everything they can. I've said this before, the thing that always wins out is technology and it won't be any different here. Once you can go into your box store store and buy a system for peanuts it will be like a gold rush. In the not to distant future there won't be a grid, PV will have a wider light spectrum and houses will be generators from roofs to walls.
The other thing is that more and more efficient appliances and heating systems will reduce our basic energy needs.

Rob
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Old 03-02-16, 07:32 AM   #25
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One more thing.
Right now I'm getting 10.7 cents a Kwh because I got in a few years ago. New installs are getting what my coop pays for power, about 3 to 4 cents a Kwh. Around 2020 my contract ends and I will go to the 3 to 4 cent rate. My intertie system was a grant from the New York Power Authority so it was free. I'm already thinking about what I'll do with my power in 2020 because then I own it completely.
Maybe set up an EV charging station, heck I'll distill water and sell it, power is power, I'll find a use for it.

Also in five years I expect EV's to be pushing out ICE cars pretty much, I won't be paying for gas, that's for sure!

Rob
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Old 03-02-16, 09:54 PM   #26
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Electric car prices are coming down every year. The newer models in general have a better battery in them, compared to older models in general. This trend will continue, and more of the general public will make the switch to electric vehicles over the next few years. This trend, along with the aging of existing EV's and battery packs, will increase the economy of scale and prices will come down on replacement hybrid and EV batteries. It's not going to happen this year or next year, but eventually the OEM's and aftermarket suppliers will be offering different capacity batteries for the same vehicle, as well as "factory certified preowned" battery packs.

Meanwhile, the rooftop PV market will continue to grow. Unlike the electric car, this industry wasn't dealt a fatal blow in the late 80's by the manufacturers. Prices for power panels continue to drop, and efficiencies continue to rise. Many scaleable systems are available today and more will be available in the very near future. These home power systems are being designed to cater to customers that own (or future customers that will own) at least one plug-in vehicle.

When you consider the amount of fuel and maintenance you will save by having a home PV array that charges your car, the whole system gets easier to digest and justify. Especially if you are commuting a half hour to work and back every weekday. I believe the grocery getters and soccer moms of the world have already started buying into this type of system in small numbers. Due to the successes of individuals here on the forums and others in the population, many other less outspoken individuals and families are becoming attracted to these complementary systems. This trend will also continue, increasing market size and economy of scale.

The automakers are already beginning to change their marketing strategies, and are preparing to proliferate electric vehicle sales in short order. You know they have to have their eyes on populating your rooftop and garage wall while you are eyeballing their shiny new vehicle.
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Old 03-02-16, 11:50 PM   #27
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A 2013 Chevy Volt, loaded, Certified Preowned with 50k miles can now be had for $15k. GM was very conservative with their batteries, only using about 65% of capacity and never fully charging or discharging them. They will probably be good for 5000+ cycles at that low level. The Volt's battery is conveniently already broken into 24 and 48v modules, too!

More cars like this on the road means more battery packs and components will be available at salvage prices for repurposing.

I'm an Automotive Master Tech. Most worry about repair costs from extra complexity in the electric drive, but any electric vehicle or hybrid capable of moving under its own power with the engine off will have much lower repair expenses for the rest of the car because nearly everything a car normally needs fixed is because of heat damage from constant high underhood and undercar temps, especially due to low airflow at low speeds or when stopped. Rubber, plastic and electronics all last longer-engine gaskets, cooling system components, grease boots on suspension components, computer modules, etc.....

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