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Old 02-19-13, 10:57 AM   #21
AC_Hacker
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I found a study addressing R290 & R1270 as a replacement for R22, HERE

They both compare very favorably.

Here is the abstract:

Quote:
Abstract

In this study, therma l performance of two hydrocarbon refrigerants of R290 and R1270 was measured in an attempt to substitute R22. They were tested in a heat pump bench tester of 1 ton capacity with a hermetic rotary compressor. Water and water/glycol mixture were employed as the secondary heat transfer fluids in the test bench. All tests were conducted under the same external conditions simulating three different air-conditioning and heat pumping conditions. Test results show that the coefficient of performance of these hydrocarbon refrigerants is up to 11.5% higher than that of R22 under all conditions. Refrigeration capacity of R290 is up to 8.2% lower than that of R22 under normal air-conditioning and heat pumping conditions. Under extremely cold temperature conditions, however, the capacity of R290 is 5% higher than that of R22. On the other hand, the capacity of R1270 is similar to that of R22 under all conditions. Compressor discharge temperatures of these hydrocarbons are reduced by 1431C as compared to R22. The amount of charge is reduced up to 58% as compared to R22. Overall, these hydrocarbons provide good performance with reasonable energy savings without any environmental problems and thus can be used as long-term alternatives for residential air-conditioning and heat pumping applications.
And HERE is a report on the successful use of R1270 in the food industry.

I think dcx has a point here... R1270 should also be considered.

Best,

-AC

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Old 02-19-13, 08:38 PM   #22
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In my argument for BBq propane gas with AtomTrainer, I did not hound this point. However, since it has come up, R1270 (propylene) is another outstanding natural refrigerant. It can be used in the same way as R290: to replace R22 with no major system modifications. It is also the primary contaminant in BBq gas bottle propane. For ordinary experimental use, its properties are very close to that of propane. Pure R1270 is marketed by gas2010 as Care 45.


dc€x,
The bottles of map gas (propylene) that I use have the same fittings as propane bottles. As such, HV23T has a good pic of the type of adapter I use to charge and recover small amounts of refrigerant. See this thread:
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/geothe...ater-r290.html
The pic is in post #3.

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Old 02-20-13, 05:20 AM   #23
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dcx,
The bottles of map gas (propylene) that I use have the same fittings as propane bottles. As such, HV23T has a good pic of the type of adapter I use to charge and recover small amounts of refrigerant. See this thread:
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/geothe...ater-r290.html
The pic is in post #3.[/QUOTE]

I have to bother a bit more rgd. the adapter of MAP-gas bottles .
You refered to a fine picture with splendid DIY-extention of an adapter.
In Europe we do not have the american standards.This is why I am wondering
how/where to buy (and by which name) this fitting you mentioned above.

In Europe these MAP-bottles are basicly for sale only with a torch ...
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Old 02-20-13, 05:20 AM   #24
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dc€x,
The bottles of map gas (propylene) that I use have the same fittings as propane bottles. As such, HV23T has a good pic of the type of adapter I use to charge and recover small amounts of refrigerant. See this thread:
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/geothe...ater-r290.html
The pic is in post #3.[/QUOTE]

I have to bother a bit more rgd. the adapter of MAP-gas bottles .
You refered to a fine picture with splendid DIY-extention of an adapter.
In Europe we do not have the american standards.This is why I am wondering
how/where to buy (and by which name) this fitting you mentioned above.

In Europe these MAP-bottles are basicly for sale only with a torch ...
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Old 02-20-13, 10:05 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dc€x View Post
...You refered to a fine picture with splendid DIY-extention of an adapter.
In Europe we do not have the american standards.This is why I am wondering
how/where to buy (and by which name) this fitting you mentioned above...
OK, now I understand...

In the US, in the HVAC industry, tradesmen most often referred to these fittings in informal terms as, "standard fittings." But in fact (in formal terms) the fitting is called 1/4 inch flare (or 1/4" flare).

So, if you were speaking casually with an HVAC technician you would say, "standard fitting", but if you were ordering the part from a parts supplier, you would specify, 1/4" flare.


Oh, and since you're going through all this, HERE IS A LINK to a page that details how I did the conversion.

Be safe, be outdoors when your work with this stuff. It's dangerous.

Best,

-AC
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Old 02-21-13, 06:29 PM   #26
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dc€x,
Here is a major european HVAC supply company:
ITE-Tools.com - Home
They have an almost military-style catalog, loaded with pictures, illustrations, and instructions. They describe their products with industry-standard words, in both inch and metric standards.
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Old 03-31-13, 04:35 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AC_Hacker View Post

-AC
Thanks AC for your help.
Originally I tried to find my way the the sources of "HEAD CONNECTORS"
(=PERFORMER) of the MAP_GAS bottles (see pic. attch.).

I wonder how in US (net shop?) you could buy these accessories (without torch-part) having "Gas valve CGA 600 connection - 1in x 20 UNEF" fit to US Worthington MAP-gas bottles?

As you see there may be a mess of standards from the European point of view.
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Old 03-31-13, 09:10 AM   #28
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Smile Prepackaged propane part procured

Quote:
Originally Posted by dcx View Post
I wonder how in US (net shop?) you could buy these accessories (without torch-part) having "Gas valve CGA 600 connection - 1in x 20 UNEF" fit to US Worthington MAP-gas bottles?
dcx,

The cheap version:
Mr Heater - LP Female Throway Adapter 1" X 1/4 MPT - F273754

The expensive version:
Camco 59213 Campfire Propane Adapter : Amazon.com : Automotive

or

Camco 59213 Campfire Propane Adapter camper Trailer RV | eBay

Main idea: if it can be made, it has been made. Your chariot awaits.
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Old 03-31-13, 09:44 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeff5may View Post
...Main idea: if it can be made, it has been made. Your chariot awaits.

Yeah, I was trying to get propane from the disposable bottles into a heat pump circuit, using a common Schrader valve that would fit standard hoses, and retain some way of controlling or stopping the gas flow rate.

I still haven't seen anything better.

-AC
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Old 03-31-13, 06:48 PM   #30
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I know, right? I only have half a dozen or so propane blowtorches sitting around. I did the same as AC_Hacker long ago without even a second guess.

But the question was.... "I live on Gilligan's Island and can only mail order a fitting from the web, please find me something expensive. Or if I can make something out of coconuts, that would be great also."☺

I saw this as a challenge to find a part that may or may not exist. With common plumbing fittings, namely a 1/4 fpt valve and a male flare adapter and the right pipe dope, the Mr. Heater RV adapter could be made to work for more than a new blowtorch would likely cost.

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