Has anyone found a comparison of water heaters?

strider3700 · 11-13-10, 10:36 PM

I'm slowly getting ready for solar hot water and one of the things I will be doing is replacing and relocating my existing electric hot water heater. The old one still works and even has a year left in the warranty but the previous owners installed it using galvanized nipples instead of brass or copper. The inlet and outlet is just a pile of rust waiting to let go that I seriously doubt will ever seal again after I pull it apart to move.

So I'm looking for another 40 gallon electric hot water tank. I'd love to got on demand but I don't have gas and I don't hear good things about the electric on demand whole house heaters. Also I have a heat pump with electric furnace backup and if the on demand heater was to come on at the same time as the heat pump back up was on the 200 amp service to the house wouldn't be enough...

Anyways I'm wondering if anyone has found somewhere comparing various models that are currently available? is there an actual difference between the 6,8,10,12 year warranty models or do you just pay more for the warranty? getting actual info on the models at the big box stores is next to impossible. The sales people just know warranty lengths and sizes...

Daox · 11-14-10, 06:48 AM

Well, a hybrid electric / heat pump water heater like Patrick just installed would obviously be more efficient.

However, if you have to go with the a straight electric water heater, all that really matters is the insulation around it. It might be cheaper to get a cheap water heater and just add insulation around it yourself. You can add as much as you'd like.

BTW, what have you heard that is bad about on demand electric water heaters? I've heard many good things. The only bad (I guess) is they do pull a TON of power when they are on. Its the same with the gas units though.

11-15-10, 06:51 AM

I agree with Daox. A heat pump water heater will make the most sense in terms of return on investment. They are expensive at $1500 but they do quality for Federal Tax Rebates and Consumer Reports did confirm that they can reduce the electricity consumed by up to 60%. Just like a heat pump air conditioner this tank will condense moisture from the air and will require access to a drain or you will need a pump to remove the condensed water which may be a consideration given your tank relocation.

Gas tankless hot water heaters can reduce your energy consumption but the electric versions are generally found to provide little savings due to the high energy demand. The return on investment on a tankless water heater can often exceed the life of the product.

strider3700 · 11-15-10, 11:05 PM

Gas isn't an option as I don't have it and won't be paying to get it.

Heat pump isn't an option since the tank needs to be silent and is in heated living space so pumping the cold into the basement just means I need to heat it back up. Also I've never seen one forsale around here and being Canadian I don't think they qualify for any sort of rebates here.

So electric tank it is. Also with the solar preheat I'm hoping the electric tank is mostly just a backup for those long cloudy periods we tend to get out west.

I found this site. The Best Water Heater: Some extra parts make all the difference

and basically it said the difference between a 6 year and a 12 year is a bit on the insulation and a second anode in the tank usually. It gives recommendations but basically seems to suggest that we get the cheaper model and spend a bit to upgrade the crappy parts to get better then the best model for less. So I'm off to research insulation levels on GE water heaters...

The site also had a crap load of info on draining the tanks, maintenance, heat traps, .... way more then I ever thought I'd want to know about hot water heaters.

11-16-10, 02:29 PM

Looks like you've got it sorted out. There isn't much to an electric hot water heater other than the tank, insulation, 2 heating elements and an anode. I replaced a heating element in my GE tank when it was only 4 years old. No big deal, especially when its empty. Draining it took a little time since it was the lower element that failed.

I'm shooting a series of videos this week for my website, Johnny on Energy, with a solar company called Alt Energy covering thermal solar (evacuated tubes) as well as PV electric. We are going to interview a couple of homeowners and ask them about why they choose solar, how the install went and what they would do differently, if anything.

PS - I love Vancouver. I traveled there for my job and for pleasure many times.

Good luck,

Johnny

gasstingy · 11-17-10, 07:56 AM

FWIW, you might consider wiring in a timer on your new electric HWH when you install it. Then, if you were the type to shower in the evening, you wouldn't run the HWH at night when it makes no sense. Next morning, the solar you are planning to install would have a chance to top up the heat energy you need during the day and that has the potential to really reduce the electric consumption.

AC_Hacker · 11-30-10, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strider3700

...the difference between a 6 year and a 12 year is a bit on the insulation and a second anode in the tank usually...

strider3700,

I don't know if you already know this, but the anode in the water heater can be replaced, by unscrewing the anode, removing the old anode, then inserting the new anode, and taping and tightening it back on. No futzing with electricity.

I guess the only reason this is not well known is the planned obsolescence thingie.

If you have a 10 year water heater and replace the anode every 8th year,
your water heater tank will last a very long time...

This babe will show you how:

YouTube - Do It Yourself: Replacing Anode in a Water Heater

Regards,

-AC_Hacker

11-13-10, 10:36 PM	#1
strider3700 Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Vancouver Island BC Posts: 745 Thanks: 23 Thanked 37 Times in 30 Posts	Has anyone found a comparison of water heaters? I'm slowly getting ready for solar hot water and one of the things I will be doing is replacing and relocating my existing electric hot water heater. The old one still works and even has a year left in the warranty but the previous owners installed it using galvanized nipples instead of brass or copper. The inlet and outlet is just a pile of rust waiting to let go that I seriously doubt will ever seal again after I pull it apart to move. So I'm looking for another 40 gallon electric hot water tank. I'd love to got on demand but I don't have gas and I don't hear good things about the electric on demand whole house heaters. Also I have a heat pump with electric furnace backup and if the on demand heater was to come on at the same time as the heat pump back up was on the 200 amp service to the house wouldn't be enough... Anyways I'm wondering if anyone has found somewhere comparing various models that are currently available? is there an actual difference between the 6,8,10,12 year warranty models or do you just pay more for the warranty? getting actual info on the models at the big box stores is next to impossible. The sales people just know warranty lengths and sizes...

11-14-10, 06:48 AM	#2
Daox Administrator Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Germantown, WI Posts: 5,525 Thanks: 1,162 Thanked 374 Times in 305 Posts	Well, a hybrid electric / heat pump water heater like Patrick just installed would obviously be more efficient. However, if you have to go with the a straight electric water heater, all that really matters is the insulation around it. It might be cheaper to get a cheap water heater and just add insulation around it yourself. You can add as much as you'd like. BTW, what have you heard that is bad about on demand electric water heaters? I've heard many good things. The only bad (I guess) is they do pull a TON of power when they are on. Its the same with the gas units though. __________________ Current project - To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. & To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Last edited by Daox; 11-14-10 at 06:51 AM..

11-15-10, 06:51 AM	#3
JohnnyonEnergy Guest Posts: n/a	Hot Water Heater Options I agree with Daox. A heat pump water heater will make the most sense in terms of return on investment. They are expensive at $1500 but they do quality for Federal Tax Rebates and Consumer Reports did confirm that they can reduce the electricity consumed by up to 60%. Just like a heat pump air conditioner this tank will condense moisture from the air and will require access to a drain or you will need a pump to remove the condensed water which may be a consideration given your tank relocation. Gas tankless hot water heaters can reduce your energy consumption but the electric versions are generally found to provide little savings due to the high energy demand. The return on investment on a tankless water heater can often exceed the life of the product.

11-15-10, 11:05 PM	#4
strider3700 Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Vancouver Island BC Posts: 745 Thanks: 23 Thanked 37 Times in 30 Posts	Gas isn't an option as I don't have it and won't be paying to get it. Heat pump isn't an option since the tank needs to be silent and is in heated living space so pumping the cold into the basement just means I need to heat it back up. Also I've never seen one forsale around here and being Canadian I don't think they qualify for any sort of rebates here. So electric tank it is. Also with the solar preheat I'm hoping the electric tank is mostly just a backup for those long cloudy periods we tend to get out west. I found this site. The Best Water Heater: Some extra parts make all the difference and basically it said the difference between a 6 year and a 12 year is a bit on the insulation and a second anode in the tank usually. It gives recommendations but basically seems to suggest that we get the cheaper model and spend a bit to upgrade the crappy parts to get better then the best model for less. So I'm off to research insulation levels on GE water heaters... The site also had a crap load of info on draining the tanks, maintenance, heat traps, .... way more then I ever thought I'd want to know about hot water heaters.

11-16-10, 02:29 PM	#5
JohnnyonEnergy Guest Posts: n/a	Looks like you've got it sorted out. There isn't much to an electric hot water heater other than the tank, insulation, 2 heating elements and an anode. I replaced a heating element in my GE tank when it was only 4 years old. No big deal, especially when its empty. Draining it took a little time since it was the lower element that failed. I'm shooting a series of videos this week for my website, Johnny on Energy, with a solar company called Alt Energy covering thermal solar (evacuated tubes) as well as PV electric. We are going to interview a couple of homeowners and ask them about why they choose solar, how the install went and what they would do differently, if anything. PS - I love Vancouver. I traveled there for my job and for pleasure many times. Good luck, Johnny

11-17-10, 07:56 AM	#6
gasstingy Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Arab, AL Posts: 491 Thanks: 109 Thanked 49 Times in 43 Posts	FWIW, you might consider wiring in a timer on your new electric HWH when you install it. Then, if you were the type to shower in the evening, you wouldn't run the HWH at night when it makes no sense. Next morning, the solar you are planning to install would have a chance to top up the heat energy you need during the day and that has the potential to really reduce the electric consumption.