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Old 07-12-15, 02:25 PM   #161
AC_Hacker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redmohawk View Post
I would factor around 50 to 60L per person per day, Here in Aust a hot water storage unit MUST heat stored water to 60 deg c every heating cycle , unless the water is NOT in circulation (IE sealed heat bank).

Obviously without going to a CO2 based system this is not feasible , and Though I believe I could source the correct components to achieve this it would be at close to commercial off the shelf units anyway . Negation the whole point of DIY for me (Lower COST).
I understand the 60C requirement, but that doesn't totally rule out 'low tech' compressors. If you looked at your heat pump as a pre-heater, you could then do the daily 60C bump-up with your heating source of choice. No need to go CO2 all the way... at least for some years hence, when scrap CO2 compressors come available.

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Originally Posted by Redmohawk View Post
Heated by window mount type unit in a compressor sized to consume around 1.5kw would be about right I hope. Removing the fan completely. Now that I think about it , its probably quicker to fabricate water boxes around the existing air con condenser and evap avoiding opening up the sealed system at all.
The air-source-HX-in-a-water-box idea is OK for someone who wants to prove that it can be done. But for long time, dependable service, you should go whole hog and get or make a good heat exchanger. (Imagine you family members and member-ettes standing in front of you wanting to know why the thing that you call your exchanger-in-a-box, has become an ugly wad of green-slime, and will not allow them to take a bath!!). Since you are doing this for domestic water consumption, a plate type HX is the wrong choice. Some form of tube-in-tube or tube-in-shell is what you want, to avoid mineral build-up from rapidly killing your system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Redmohawk View Post
Ground is a sand/clay type with a water table around the 5m mark average year round ground temp below 1m is 15.5 deg c . Climate is Mediterranean like , summers are 25 deg nights 36 deg days with peaks of 8 to 10 days over 40 deg c 44 deg 2 to 3 times a year. Winters -8 early mornings frosts day temps around 12 to 13 deg c but ground temp remains 15 deg c below 1m.
I can not recommend this book more highly: CLGS Installation Guide (#21020). There is information in there to guide you through all the Ground Source considerations.

As far as the actual heat pump hacking... there is no better book than this forum... you are in the right place.

Do not fear breaking into the system... we are here to help.

Sincerely,

AC_Hacker

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Old 07-13-15, 01:01 AM   #162
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New thread started to avoid Hijack
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Old 08-06-15, 08:06 PM   #163
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UPDATE:
The inlaws came to stay the past few days. Here are the numbers.
3.5 days
5 extra people + me and wife = 7 people
6 loads of laundry with wash on the warm water setting
4 dish washer loads
and about 9-11 showers a day
plus what ever hot water was used for normal sink dishes/hand washing.

Results:
17kwh
.11 cents per kwh
total of $1.87
divided by 3.5 days = .54 cents a day
pretending that this was for a normal family of 7 people full time this unit should use .54 cents x 31 days = $16.74 or 365 days x .54 cents = $197.10 for hot water all year for a large family of 7 people.

The bore hole temp never dropped below 36F even though the compressor ran for 13-14 hours a day.

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Old 08-07-15, 06:06 AM   #164
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Memphis,

GREAT performance data!

Steve
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Old 08-07-15, 10:48 AM   #165
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What? It still works? IMPOSSIBLE! That should have exploded by now.... Grumble humbug.

Just kidding. Good to hear it held up under a heavy load, well on its way to paying for itself. Once you break even, the rig will just keep on saving more and more money as energy prices go up and up.

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Old 08-07-15, 12:02 PM   #166
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Wow, very impressive for that kind of usage.
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Old 08-08-15, 02:37 AM   #167
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MEMPHIS91,

Sounds like your system has passed the acid test!

* * *

In the beginning of this thread, you said that you wanted to 'give back'. These were your words...

I want to say that your project has not only been an adventure, and a success, but you really have given back just as you said you wanted to do.

You have left a written and photographed record of you plan, your follow-through, your mistakes, and your ultimate success, which will stand as an inspiration and road-map for very many readers to come.

I hope that others who read your thread recognize the very wide-ranging value of your example, not only your success, but the fact that you elected to Give Back... I hope others follow your good example.

Thank you, and randen and any other EcoRenovators who have taken the effort to shared the process of their work, as well as their success.

Sincerely,

-AC_Hacker
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Old 08-08-15, 11:17 AM   #168
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Thanks guy! I'm very glad its still working.
Ac, Thanks man! Glad I was as helpful as I intended.
Thanks to all who help by taking the time to write long replies to get me on the right track!
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Old 08-17-15, 09:51 AM   #169
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Just wanted to say thanks for your really elegant solution for putting the tubing coil into the hot water tank. Your plumbing days certainly helped you there and you helped so many of the rest of us!
And the long tale of dialing in your charge and cap tube (and being steered away from the txv) really inspired me to get back at mine.
Thanks Guy!
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Old 08-21-15, 06:53 AM   #170
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Ron, thank you, I hope your system fires very well.

I forgot to post the 2 month data, so far from start to 2 months it used 144 kwh.

Next step/ idea, I really love this DX system, but going off grid makes for some changes. I have a few options that I would like some opinions on.
First would be to solar power the system, I could turn down the thermostat lower and decrease the max needed amps. Then 500 watts of solar power. I could use no battery and only let it run during the day, with 90 gallons of storage I could go a day or 2 without any sun and still have some hot water. And have a generator just in case I got no sun for longer than that. Or a could add some batteries and extend the run time.
Second would be to go solar water setup and use the heat exchanger in a closed loop system.
Or a could use a combo of the second option and a wood boiler loop in the chimney of one of my 2 wood stoves.
Or a could do a huge tangled mess of things and use all three options with the DX in the bottom of the tank and put in another hear exchanger in the top for solar and wood boiler loop.
Ideas?

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