Ac coupled battery backup with solar

nokiasixteth · 03-13-21, 08:57 PM

I have had my 5.2 kw solar system running for a few yrs now so far the grids been pretty reliable . But the thought of a power outage for even a day or two with me having perfectly good solar panels on my roof but useless had me thinking . So after some digging i found my solar edge grid tied system was compatable with curtailment from other inverters if they had that capability.

So i went ahead and added 2 small 42 volt 66 ah lithium batteries and a schnieder 4048 for a backup this works fine . To test to see if it would work hooked it to a backfeed breaker and shut the main breaker off outside to inside my house then turned the inverter on. This is where one problem arises i dont have a inside panel shutoff switch. It is on the outside.
One solution is obviously buy a new breaker panel and rewire the inside to it and add a generator interlocking kit.
Second solution possibly could be adding a another 100 amp breaker inside moving the main feed wireing to that breaker to feed the panel and have a seesaw type switch so that only one can be turned on at once .

Does any one have any experience in such being the indoor dont have a main off switch inside ?

nokiasixteth · 03-20-21, 10:26 PM

Decided to go with the new breaker . SquareD with interlock kit will do a smaller sub panel for critical loads for everyday backup. But long term backup will be able to switch the interlock kit on and isolate my self from grid and Sw 4048 create the grid to provide power to my panels. Have my lines temporary as they will be changing just needed proof of concept first before i put more money into it. Also have a auto gen start in case or long term cloudiness i can turn the solar off and turn the generator on to charge the batteries if they get critically low.

jeff5may · 03-21-21, 04:49 AM

Check with a local electrician, different states have different rules for what's gotta hookup how. Many wiring possibilities and only a few approved layouts. Plus it's high voltage utility power. I just went through the ordeal with a natural gas hookup. Tech came out, didn't like this. Redo this. Next visit, I don't trust your gage, go buy new. Next visit, shutoff this valve. Next visit, looks ok, now drop to like 3 psi or something. It took 2 weeks, and then we could finally go pay a small fortune for a gas meter. Yayyy!

Hey, how did the mini split grasshopper fried board end up? Never really heard anything about it.

nokiasixteth · 03-21-21, 11:21 AM

Here in the sticks we have propane tanks n have to pump in sunlight . They may but it's doubtful. My person for interconnection came out and said my install was one of the best installs he has seen so far in this state . I'm pretty sure being it's a generator the interlocking kit would suffice being my place would be isolated from there grid during a power outage . I'll ask the juice company about that to.

The mini split . Ha I tried n failed the week all that cold came through I ordered it week before installed it n had it going for all that cold . I get time I will probably work on it again find a board or attempt to re solder some of those traces

jeff5may · 03-21-21, 10:46 PM

Ok, don't hesitate to post it up on the other thread whenever you do something with it. I'll sure offer any help I can. Most all of the inverter mini splits have muscles in them like front load washers of the last decade or two. Just like HVAC, the appliance techs never do board repair, only remove and replace. It's a shame, because most of the stuff is an easy fix.

nokiasixteth · 03-23-21, 08:45 PM

Im afraid that the board with all of those traces messed up is a bit above my skill level being i have not until that board soldered

nokiasixteth · 05-09-21, 12:56 PM

Updates . I decided being i had a challenger breaker panel to go ahead and upgrade the old breaker panel with a new square d breaker panel with a shut off switch. Also i added a sub panel that will be a critical load panel . (I ant had a chance to wire it yet. ) Both are square d panels. Also i added a 20 ft ground rod because the one the place i am in only had a 3 ft piece of rebar for a rod.

When completed for a short term outage. I will have an automatic transfer switch that switches on the generator feed to the inverter in case it is needed and For the inverter i bought an auto gen start for when the batteries get low the generator will crank , it will qualify the power source and idle for a few seconds then charge when full the AGS will shut off the generator and batteries will keep going. During a short term power outage the generator shouldnt crank.

During long term outage i have a interlocking kit hooked to my main panel to energize the entire house now minus i think the oven its on the outdoor breaker panel. The generator will be of use .

nokiasixteth · 06-20-21, 08:10 AM

I have it almost finished but i went another route . I can easily move one wire if i ever wanted to use the solar panels but i decided to use the 4048 with a generator and the Nissan leaf batteries being i did not want to accidently mess up some settings on my solar edge. On the input side i ran a double throw switch . If the power is going to be out for an extended time (day+) i can go out throw the switch to generator and hook the autogenswitch so that when it is low it will charge the batteries. No worrying about voiding warranties and such on my main solar system.

nokiasixteth · 07-23-21, 07:58 PM

Some drunk ran into a light pole and knocked out power . What do you know i didnt have my batteries fully charged so halfway during the night about 9 i had to flip the generator on to charge up the batteries. A auto transfer switch from grid to generator would be nice but the double throw works just fine . I was able to run the ac for a few hours until the inverter shut down on me.

nokiasixteth · 10-17-21, 09:18 AM

Does anyone have any experience with ardunio systems ? I think this would be a pretty easy and safe way to make a dump load the 4048 does have frequency shift but i would prefer to keep using the panels to heat water run a small pool pump something of use instead of just shutting them off with the frequency shift.

03-13-21, 08:57 PM	#1
nokiasixteth Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Earth Posts: 348 Thanks: 43 Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts	Ac coupled battery backup with solar I have had my 5.2 kw solar system running for a few yrs now so far the grids been pretty reliable . But the thought of a power outage for even a day or two with me having perfectly good solar panels on my roof but useless had me thinking . So after some digging i found my solar edge grid tied system was compatable with curtailment from other inverters if they had that capability. So i went ahead and added 2 small 42 volt 66 ah lithium batteries and a schnieder 4048 for a backup this works fine . To test to see if it would work hooked it to a backfeed breaker and shut the main breaker off outside to inside my house then turned the inverter on. This is where one problem arises i dont have a inside panel shutoff switch. It is on the outside. One solution is obviously buy a new breaker panel and rewire the inside to it and add a generator interlocking kit. Second solution possibly could be adding a another 100 amp breaker inside moving the main feed wireing to that breaker to feed the panel and have a seesaw type switch so that only one can be turned on at once . Does any one have any experience in such being the indoor dont have a main off switch inside ?

07-23-21, 07:58 PM	#9
nokiasixteth Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Earth Posts: 348 Thanks: 43 Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts	Was successfully backed up Some drunk ran into a light pole and knocked out power . What do you know i didnt have my batteries fully charged so halfway during the night about 9 i had to flip the generator on to charge up the batteries. A auto transfer switch from grid to generator would be nice but the double throw works just fine . I was able to run the ac for a few hours until the inverter shut down on me.

03-20-21, 10:26 PM	#2
nokiasixteth Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Earth Posts: 348 Thanks: 43 Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts	Decided to go with the new breaker . SquareD with interlock kit will do a smaller sub panel for critical loads for everyday backup. But long term backup will be able to switch the interlock kit on and isolate my self from grid and Sw 4048 create the grid to provide power to my panels. Have my lines temporary as they will be changing just needed proof of concept first before i put more money into it. Also have a auto gen start in case or long term cloudiness i can turn the solar off and turn the generator on to charge the batteries if they get critically low.

03-21-21, 04:49 AM	#3
jeff5may Supreme EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: elizabethtown, ky, USA Posts: 2,431 Thanks: 431 Thanked 619 Times in 517 Posts	Check with a local electrician, different states have different rules for what's gotta hookup how. Many wiring possibilities and only a few approved layouts. Plus it's high voltage utility power. I just went through the ordeal with a natural gas hookup. Tech came out, didn't like this. Redo this. Next visit, I don't trust your gage, go buy new. Next visit, shutoff this valve. Next visit, looks ok, now drop to like 3 psi or something. It took 2 weeks, and then we could finally go pay a small fortune for a gas meter. Yayyy! Hey, how did the mini split grasshopper fried board end up? Never really heard anything about it.

03-21-21, 11:21 AM	#4
nokiasixteth Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Earth Posts: 348 Thanks: 43 Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts	Here in the sticks we have propane tanks n have to pump in sunlight . They may but it's doubtful. My person for interconnection came out and said my install was one of the best installs he has seen so far in this state . I'm pretty sure being it's a generator the interlocking kit would suffice being my place would be isolated from there grid during a power outage . I'll ask the juice company about that to. The mini split . Ha I tried n failed the week all that cold came through I ordered it week before installed it n had it going for all that cold . I get time I will probably work on it again find a board or attempt to re solder some of those traces

03-21-21, 10:46 PM	#5
jeff5may Supreme EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: elizabethtown, ky, USA Posts: 2,431 Thanks: 431 Thanked 619 Times in 517 Posts	Ok, don't hesitate to post it up on the other thread whenever you do something with it. I'll sure offer any help I can. Most all of the inverter mini splits have muscles in them like front load washers of the last decade or two. Just like HVAC, the appliance techs never do board repair, only remove and replace. It's a shame, because most of the stuff is an easy fix.

03-23-21, 08:45 PM	#6
nokiasixteth Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Earth Posts: 348 Thanks: 43 Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts	Im afraid that the board with all of those traces messed up is a bit above my skill level being i have not until that board soldered

05-09-21, 12:56 PM	#7
nokiasixteth Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Earth Posts: 348 Thanks: 43 Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts	Updates . I decided being i had a challenger breaker panel to go ahead and upgrade the old breaker panel with a new square d breaker panel with a shut off switch. Also i added a sub panel that will be a critical load panel . (I ant had a chance to wire it yet. ) Both are square d panels. Also i added a 20 ft ground rod because the one the place i am in only had a 3 ft piece of rebar for a rod. When completed for a short term outage. I will have an automatic transfer switch that switches on the generator feed to the inverter in case it is needed and For the inverter i bought an auto gen start for when the batteries get low the generator will crank , it will qualify the power source and idle for a few seconds then charge when full the AGS will shut off the generator and batteries will keep going. During a short term power outage the generator shouldnt crank. During long term outage i have a interlocking kit hooked to my main panel to energize the entire house now minus i think the oven its on the outdoor breaker panel. The generator will be of use .

06-20-21, 08:10 AM	#8
nokiasixteth Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Earth Posts: 348 Thanks: 43 Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts	I have it almost finished but i went another route . I can easily move one wire if i ever wanted to use the solar panels but i decided to use the 4048 with a generator and the Nissan leaf batteries being i did not want to accidently mess up some settings on my solar edge. On the input side i ran a double throw switch . If the power is going to be out for an extended time (day+) i can go out throw the switch to generator and hook the autogenswitch so that when it is low it will charge the batteries. No worrying about voiding warranties and such on my main solar system.

10-17-21, 09:18 AM	#10
nokiasixteth Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Earth Posts: 348 Thanks: 43 Thanked 14 Times in 13 Posts	Does anyone have any experience with ardunio systems ? I think this would be a pretty easy and safe way to make a dump load the 4048 does have frequency shift but i would prefer to keep using the panels to heat water run a small pool pump something of use instead of just shutting them off with the frequency shift.