Cistern - Page 2

NiHaoMike · 10-18-17, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oil pan 4

If I was going to go off grid I would use good old fashioned lead acid forklift batteries.

LiFePO4 batteries have started to become about as cheap as good quality lead acid.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cviyIIvBlto

oil pan 4 · 10-18-17, 11:21 AM

I already have used LiFePO4 batteries and don't want to use them for several reasons.
1 they suffer really bad from numbing.
2 when charged when at below 20°F their capacity can be permanently damaged by 20%, the first time you do it.
3 higher temperature charge discharge cycles also damage capacity.
4 there are less battery charger options for lithium. There are none available in 48v. I know how to trick a lead acid charger to be really close but it's not perfect.

Then there is the problem that I can't order a 48v 1000+ amp hour battery bank.
I would probably really be looking for something at least in the 1500Ah+ range.

oil pan 4 · 10-20-17, 05:58 PM

I found a sand pool filter on the property.
I hadn't considered using a pool filter to filter cistern water.
Any ideas?
Or a waste of time?

Fordguy64 · 10-21-17, 08:20 AM

I guess it could work for the initial cleaning of water. Removing larger particles and things. Probably good enough for toilets and things like that. But I would filter more for potable

oil pan 4 · 10-21-17, 09:45 AM

I didn't think it would make the water safe to drink.
I was thinking more along the lines of a clarifier, something that takes the big chunks out with out having to buy a filter.
Still going to use charcoal, UV and chlorine to make it potable.

Also I found another well on the property an 8 inch bore with no pumping equipment in it.
So it definitely looks like off grid water is going to happen.

ecomodded · 10-21-17, 07:54 PM

Good find now with luck there is tasty water below waiting to be pumped out.

Makes me think a 12v well pump would be nice and help to keep the PV / battery system simple

Fordguy64 · 10-21-17, 10:28 PM

You shouldn’t need chlorine with uv and filter. I’d like to keep ALL chemicals out of my water.. my plan is 3 pre filters and then uv. It’s pretty common for cistern filtration. After of course the pre filter from the gutters aka first flush.

oil pan 4 · 10-22-17, 03:28 PM

Can a 12v pump even lift 200 to 300ft?
Wells here have to be really deep.
I will need at least a 3/4hp submerged pump pumping to a non-pressurized tank and that might only get me a few gallons per minute.
I will likely go with a 1hp pumping to an atmospheric tank so I can get 5 to 10 gpm.

I would consider solar powering the well pump since it's a 500ft run from the house to the well.
To power a 1hp pump off 240v it would only need 12ga wire. But that's still a lot of 12ga wire.

ecomodded · 10-22-17, 09:25 PM

Humor me Im thinking you could lower a fishing line with something on it to check for the water table.

Must be some nice DC well pumps in use by off grid people ,I spotted this 12/24v $80 Seaflow thats rated down to 230 ft on 24v

Description
This solid diaphragm style pump structure is simple and small, making it fit well in many style of wells and water systems, it does not displace too much water.
Weighing just 3 kg, it is easy for most people to handle.
Installation is simple and fast. The "quick disconnect" feature allows the pump to be easily separated from the tube via the patent pending "Watertight-Gland" design. Quickly control the pump when maintenance is needed.
Even if your well runs dry or you need to test in dry conditions, no damage will be done to this durable pump!
The positive displacement, 3 chamber solid design diaphragm pump is run by a permanent magnet thermally protected motor.
The stainless steel fastener and 50 mesh stainless steel inlet screen are long lasting and non-corrosive.
The housing is also corrosion proof, for a pump that will last for years and years in many conditions and environments.
With a flow rate of 6 1pm, this is an efficient pump for most watering needs. The maximum lift is 230 feet, which is sufficient for most wells and situations.
1.6 gpm (Gallons per Minute) flow rate
solid diaphragm structure
230 ft maximum lift
100 ft maximum submersible depth
solar power possible
3 kg weight
stainless steel fastener
stainless steel inlet screen
orange color housing

oil pan 4 · 10-22-17, 10:00 PM

The well I have is probably at least 200ft deep, could be 300ft deep. I doubt the water level is much less than 200ft, according to farmers and the well service around here.
Next chance I get I will be going out there with my nylon string and long tape measure and measure total depth and water level. If it's 300ft deep there could be up to 100ft of water in there. But I doubt that there will be that much.
I going to be planting something like nut trees that will need to be watered and will need a lot more than 1 or 2 gpm.

10-21-17, 07:54 PM	#16
ecomodded Supreme EcoRenovator Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Vancouver Island,Canada. Posts: 1,037 Thanks: 116 Thanked 100 Times in 87 Posts	Good find now with luck there is tasty water below waiting to be pumped out. Makes me think a 12v well pump would be nice and help to keep the PV / battery system simple __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

10-22-17, 09:25 PM	#19
ecomodded Supreme EcoRenovator Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Vancouver Island,Canada. Posts: 1,037 Thanks: 116 Thanked 100 Times in 87 Posts	Humor me Im thinking you could lower a fishing line with something on it to check for the water table. Must be some nice DC well pumps in use by off grid people ,I spotted this 12/24v $80 Seaflow thats rated down to 230 ft on 24v Description This solid diaphragm style pump structure is simple and small, making it fit well in many style of wells and water systems, it does not displace too much water. Weighing just 3 kg, it is easy for most people to handle. Installation is simple and fast. The "quick disconnect" feature allows the pump to be easily separated from the tube via the patent pending "Watertight-Gland" design. Quickly control the pump when maintenance is needed. Even if your well runs dry or you need to test in dry conditions, no damage will be done to this durable pump! The positive displacement, 3 chamber solid design diaphragm pump is run by a permanent magnet thermally protected motor. The stainless steel fastener and 50 mesh stainless steel inlet screen are long lasting and non-corrosive. The housing is also corrosion proof, for a pump that will last for years and years in many conditions and environments. With a flow rate of 6 1pm, this is an efficient pump for most watering needs. The maximum lift is 230 feet, which is sufficient for most wells and situations. 1.6 gpm (Gallons per Minute) flow rate solid diaphragm structure 230 ft maximum lift 100 ft maximum submersible depth solar power possible 3 kg weight stainless steel fastener stainless steel inlet screen orange color housing __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

10-18-17, 11:21 AM	#12
oil pan 4 Land owner Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: NM Posts: 1,026 Thanks: 12 Thanked 127 Times in 107 Posts	I already have used LiFePO4 batteries and don't want to use them for several reasons. 1 they suffer really bad from numbing. 2 when charged when at below 20°F their capacity can be permanently damaged by 20%, the first time you do it. 3 higher temperature charge discharge cycles also damage capacity. 4 there are less battery charger options for lithium. There are none available in 48v. I know how to trick a lead acid charger to be really close but it's not perfect. Then there is the problem that I can't order a 48v 1000+ amp hour battery bank. I would probably really be looking for something at least in the 1500Ah+ range.

10-20-17, 05:58 PM	#13
oil pan 4 Land owner Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: NM Posts: 1,026 Thanks: 12 Thanked 127 Times in 107 Posts	I found a sand pool filter on the property. I hadn't considered using a pool filter to filter cistern water. Any ideas? Or a waste of time?

10-21-17, 08:20 AM	#14
Fordguy64 Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Cincinnati ohio Posts: 338 Thanks: 40 Thanked 35 Times in 31 Posts	I guess it could work for the initial cleaning of water. Removing larger particles and things. Probably good enough for toilets and things like that. But I would filter more for potable

10-21-17, 09:45 AM	#15
oil pan 4 Land owner Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: NM Posts: 1,026 Thanks: 12 Thanked 127 Times in 107 Posts	I didn't think it would make the water safe to drink. I was thinking more along the lines of a clarifier, something that takes the big chunks out with out having to buy a filter. Still going to use charcoal, UV and chlorine to make it potable. Also I found another well on the property an 8 inch bore with no pumping equipment in it. So it definitely looks like off grid water is going to happen.

10-21-17, 10:28 PM	#17
Fordguy64 Journeyman EcoRenovator Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Cincinnati ohio Posts: 338 Thanks: 40 Thanked 35 Times in 31 Posts	You shouldn’t need chlorine with uv and filter. I’d like to keep ALL chemicals out of my water.. my plan is 3 pre filters and then uv. It’s pretty common for cistern filtration. After of course the pre filter from the gutters aka first flush.

10-22-17, 03:28 PM	#18
oil pan 4 Land owner Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: NM Posts: 1,026 Thanks: 12 Thanked 127 Times in 107 Posts	Can a 12v pump even lift 200 to 300ft? Wells here have to be really deep. I will need at least a 3/4hp submerged pump pumping to a non-pressurized tank and that might only get me a few gallons per minute. I will likely go with a 1hp pumping to an atmospheric tank so I can get 5 to 10 gpm. I would consider solar powering the well pump since it's a 500ft run from the house to the well. To power a 1hp pump off 240v it would only need 12ga wire. But that's still a lot of 12ga wire.

10-22-17, 10:00 PM	#20
oil pan 4 Land owner Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: NM Posts: 1,026 Thanks: 12 Thanked 127 Times in 107 Posts	The well I have is probably at least 200ft deep, could be 300ft deep. I doubt the water level is much less than 200ft, according to farmers and the well service around here. Next chance I get I will be going out there with my nylon string and long tape measure and measure total depth and water level. If it's 300ft deep there could be up to 100ft of water in there. But I doubt that there will be that much. I going to be planting something like nut trees that will need to be watered and will need a lot more than 1 or 2 gpm.