Solar hot water storage + paraffin wax? - Page 2

buffalobillpatrick · 03-22-14, 09:59 PM

From this study:
http://www.worldenergy.org/documents...papers/412.pdf

Paraffin:
coefficient of thermal conduction – solid = .2W/mK
coefficient of thermal conduction – liquid = .15W/mK

Paraffin is a pretty good insulator (both thermal & electrical)

They put the paraffin into vertical SS 2.35" (60mm) tubes to increase surface area.
But they were looking for quick freeze/thaw times.

It seems that a 275gal IBC Tote tank won't have enough surface area? for a daily freeze/ thaw, but do I need that?

If I get enough winter solar gain that on average all the paraffin gets melted, then I think I can make it through 3-4 days of bad solar conditions with useful heat in tank. ?????

BBP

stevehull · 02-28-16, 07:09 AM

BBP,

Any updates on how this all worked out?

Steve

buffalobillpatrick · 02-28-16, 10:37 AM

Hi Steve, on hold until I sell current house.

Mobile Master Tech · 03-03-16, 02:02 PM

BBP, thanks for linking to this thread. Nice tank!

First, PEX has low thermal conductivity, especially in 3/4" or larger because of the wall thickness. For not much more, you can get 1' corrugated stainless that has twice the surface area, tons more turbulence and probably quadruple the heat transfer. I got lucky and got a 98ft roll for under $100 shipped on ebay.

If you will be cycling the tank across the PCM's melt temp frequently, PCM makes sense. If only a few times per year, I would just use water and call it a day. Paraffins will be stable at any temp, salt hydrates are sensitive to temperature extremes. Candle wax for pillar and taper candles melts at a higher temp than wax for votives, container candles, etc. The potentially cheap price may offset the range of melt temp and slightly lower enthalpy.

Stratification only happens in the lower reaches of a 5ft or deeper still tank, not much happens in the top few feet or if there is any turbulence whatsoever. If you positioned your HX coils below the level of the wax so the wax doesn't insulate it but still within the top few feet, it will be as effective as if it were at the top. You could also float heatset PET, or even PP bottles full of wax to prevent the insulating effect. Tidier than "free-range" wax. Tie a cord to them if using a PCM heavier than water.

Put heavygage aluminum foil down the center of the bottles and use bottles with 8" or smaller cross section if you use paraffins and you want to get the heat out before the next ice age.

buffalobillpatrick · 03-03-16, 02:28 PM

[/IMG]

DIY Hydraulic Seperator / Mixer

Taco 007 on left side input, speed controlled by Erie BB3000 with it's temperature controlling sensor on output right side after Grundfos Alpha

03-22-14, 09:59 PM	#11
buffalobillpatrick Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Florissant, Colorado Posts: 599 Thanks: 814 Thanked 59 Times in 55 Posts	From this study: http://www.worldenergy.org/documents...papers/412.pdf Paraffin: coefficient of thermal conduction – solid = .2W/mK coefficient of thermal conduction – liquid = .15W/mK Paraffin is a pretty good insulator (both thermal & electrical) They put the paraffin into vertical SS 2.35" (60mm) tubes to increase surface area. But they were looking for quick freeze/thaw times. It seems that a 275gal IBC Tote tank won't have enough surface area? for a daily freeze/ thaw, but do I need that? If I get enough winter solar gain that on average all the paraffin gets melted, then I think I can make it through 3-4 days of bad solar conditions with useful heat in tank. ????? BBP Last edited by buffalobillpatrick; 03-22-14 at 10:05 PM..

02-28-16, 07:09 AM	#12
stevehull Steve Hull Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: hilly, tree covered Arcadia, OK USA Posts: 826 Thanks: 241 Thanked 165 Times in 123 Posts	BBP, Any updates on how this all worked out? Steve __________________ consulting on geothermal heating/cooling & rational energy use since 1990

03-03-16, 02:02 PM	#14
Mobile Master Tech Apprentice EcoRenovator Join Date: May 2012 Location: Atlanta, Ga Posts: 142 Thanks: 38 Thanked 41 Times in 34 Posts	BBP, thanks for linking to this thread. Nice tank! First, PEX has low thermal conductivity, especially in 3/4" or larger because of the wall thickness. For not much more, you can get 1' corrugated stainless that has twice the surface area, tons more turbulence and probably quadruple the heat transfer. I got lucky and got a 98ft roll for under $100 shipped on ebay. If you will be cycling the tank across the PCM's melt temp frequently, PCM makes sense. If only a few times per year, I would just use water and call it a day. Paraffins will be stable at any temp, salt hydrates are sensitive to temperature extremes. Candle wax for pillar and taper candles melts at a higher temp than wax for votives, container candles, etc. The potentially cheap price may offset the range of melt temp and slightly lower enthalpy. Stratification only happens in the lower reaches of a 5ft or deeper still tank, not much happens in the top few feet or if there is any turbulence whatsoever. If you positioned your HX coils below the level of the wax so the wax doesn't insulate it but still within the top few feet, it will be as effective as if it were at the top. You could also float heatset PET, or even PP bottles full of wax to prevent the insulating effect. Tidier than "free-range" wax. Tie a cord to them if using a PCM heavier than water. Put heavygage aluminum foil down the center of the bottles and use bottles with 8" or smaller cross section if you use paraffins and you want to get the heat out before the next ice age. __________________ "I‘d put my money on the sun and solar energy. What a source of power! I hope we don‘t have to wait until oil and coal run out before we tackle that." Thomas Edison, 1847 — 1931 Last edited by Mobile Master Tech; 03-15-16 at 08:09 AM..

02-28-16, 10:37 AM	#13
buffalobillpatrick Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Florissant, Colorado Posts: 599 Thanks: 814 Thanked 59 Times in 55 Posts	Hi Steve, on hold until I sell current house.

03-03-16, 02:28 PM	#15
buffalobillpatrick Master EcoRenovator Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Florissant, Colorado Posts: 599 Thanks: 814 Thanked 59 Times in 55 Posts	[/IMG] DIY Hydraulic Seperator / Mixer Taco 007 on left side input, speed controlled by Erie BB3000 with it's temperature controlling sensor on output right side after Grundfos Alpha