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-   -   A7 AirTap install (ASHP hot water heater) (https://ecorenovator.org/forum/showthread.php?t=2286)

Xringer 08-08-12 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by berniebenz (Post 23556)
X,
Link to the source of A7 bar graph of COP vs. Amb Temp. Please. Itís not in the install manual.
Thx, Bernie

That came from a Treehugger site.. :p

AirTap: A Heat Pump For Your Hot Water Heater: Hot or Not? : TreeHugger

S-F 08-08-12 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by randen (Post 23522)
Maybe to meet your de-humidification goal you will need to rent a room out to a teenager or two. The income from the rent will offset the cost for other eco-renovativating projects and the constant long showers will help you meet the goals of de-humidification with the Air-taps operation to meet the need.

Best wishes for Mrs Xringer
Randen

This has my vote for the best post in the thread! :thumbup:

raydias 08-08-12 05:50 PM

Just an off beat idea, since these units take the heat from the air and heats water, what if you mount the unit in your attic? The heat in the attic would definitely the Airtap and the cooling would benefit the attic. My attic hits over 120 in the summer.

Not sure if anyone has already mentioned this. Just an off beat idea

MN Renovator 08-08-12 06:44 PM

I thought about that idea but if you put it in the attic, you're stuck with freezing conditions in the winter since he lives in the New England Noreaster zone. I think the basement is ideal where he lives.

AC_Hacker 08-08-12 07:59 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by raydias (Post 23560)
...since these units take the heat from the air and heats water, what if you mount the unit in your attic?

Since your average temp in Lincoln, CA looks like this:


...it would make brilliant sense.

Not off-beat at all, you're really using your head!

But with near-by Sacramento having 265 sunny day per year (and your location might actually be higher) it might be a better idea for you to go straight to solar heated water and bypass the AirTap all together.

That would give you a double advantage, in that your hot water would soon become very inexpensive, AND the solar collectors would provide shade for your roof, thus reducing your cooling (AC) load.

If you're a DIY guy, solar collectors can be had for almost nothing.

If you're not a DIY guy, you might Google for installers in your area.

-AC_Hacker

Xringer 08-08-12 08:24 PM

The A7 should last 5-10 years. My guess is 7.2 years.. ;)
If my tank is still good when it goes, I'm going to get one of the UL listed Geyer models..
Geyser-R | Nyle Systems – Energy Saving Heat Pump Solutions

One problem that I see, is the anode rod is under the A7 box..
I'm going to have to slide the A7 out to the next set of holes in it's rails.
Then, I'll be able to remove the anode. I'm thinking once a year inspections.

~~~
I have been thinking about solar hot air heating of the basement for years.
But, placing a hot air collector in the front yard is a non-starter.
So, maybe hot attic air will be somehow usable.
It's been pretty dark here for about an hour, 77F outdoors, but it's 92F in the attic.
It gets up to 135F up there in mid summer.

In the winter, it routinely gets well above 65F up there.
But, I've been warned against bringing that moist air inside the house.
People tell me it would cause more problems than it was worth.

So, maybe I can locate an Air-to-Refrigerant HX up there?

Use one of my surplus wall AC units in the basement,
http://www.daviddarling.info/images/air_conditioner.jpg
but locate the Evaporator coil up in the attic.?.

Install a heat sensor up there, so during the winter, when the attic gets up to 70F,
the AC comes on and starts pumping attic heat downstairs.?.

It would only run during day time, (if it's sunny) when we are likely to be using hotwater.. :cool:
Plus, if I ran the AC off spare PV (stayed off-grid), it could be very cheap to run.


It's a bit complex.. But maybe there's another way.?.
~~~

One other idea that has crossed my feeble mind is stealing from Peter to pay Paul.
I would steal heat from the living areas upstairs!!

Please read on before yelling at me.. Because it's also using solar. :D
Many times during the winter, when the sun comes shining into the south windows, the Sanyos go into idle mode.
While the indoor temperature keeps climbing. My wife closes the shades, to control the heat gain.
(And I have seen her open windows when it's 20F outside)!

Anyways, the Heat Stealer would be a ducted fan blowing warm air down to the A7.
The Stealer fan would only be active when the A7 turned on, AND when the air upstairs in the kitchen was getting a bit too warm.
(Wife cooking, heat off the refrigerator, solar heat gain & etc).

It would be easy to control, since the A7 has a 120VAC outlet on it's back panel, that could power a small fan.
http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f1...W/P1000582.jpg
The temperature controller is already in stock.
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/sale-t...html#post23108

Not really so much Stealing, but more like regulating heating..
Keep it from getting too hot upstairs! :p

randen 08-08-12 09:10 PM

Xringer

What about a simple differential controller bringing warm air into your basement when ever warm air is avalible. Warm air would find its way eventually into your living area anyway and warm the basement walls floor etc. I believe that extra humid days for attic air would be rare. You do have now a de-humidifier in the basement. In the winter the air is extremly dry. Here in Canada the humidity falls as S^*# it gathers on the ground and not in the attic.

The extra heat you bring in for next to nothing would pay you many fold.

Randen

Xringer 08-08-12 10:31 PM

I agree with you Randen, because, the past two winters,
I've been watching the dew-point and the ice that builds up on the Sanyos.
It only occurs at night or early in the morning.
I've never seen a defrost cycle after the sun has been up a couple of hours.

The attic air seems to be okay to me. I've never seen any rust up there at all.
Condensation doesn't seem to be a factor in the attic.

I already own a nice differential controller. So that part would be easy.
But, the long ducting would be a problem. I've been looking for a good place
for a top-to-bottom duct, but no really good locations are jumping out at me.

Ducting for the kitchen heat stealer hack would be short and sweet..
A controlled amount of heat would be delivered where it's needed.

A top-to-bottom duct would be harder, I've been thinking that a 4" PVC
pipe driven by a 15w blower might bring down some warm air..
FanTech HP2133 Radon Mitigation Fan 134 CFM 650737021337 | eBay

Humm, pressure equalization.?. LOL! I could hook up a second HP2133 to do actual Radon mitigation,
and dump the radioactive air from my 'hot' sump hole outdoors, above the roof line. (Per code).

Right now, the hole is sealed, but Radon gas is always accumulating down there and decaying.
Might be good to move some of that gas out of the basement during the winter.
It's staying around 2.5 pCi/L, and that's well below the national action level of 4 pCi/L
But if I could get it down under 1.5 pCi/L, that would be okay.

Daox 08-09-12 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xringer (Post 23565)
I have been thinking about solar hot air heating of the basement for years.
But, placing a hot air collector in the front yard is a non-starter.
So, maybe hot attic air will be somehow usable.
It's been pretty dark here for about an hour, 77F outdoors, but it's 92F in the attic.
It gets up to 135F up there in mid summer.

In the winter, it routinely gets well above 65F up there.
But, I've been warned against bringing that moist air inside the house.
People tell me it would cause more problems than it was worth.

I don't know why you'd have humid air in your attic in winter. The outside air should be very dry. If you have humid air it must be coming from some other place.

randen 08-09-12 07:11 AM

Most retros around here run vents up thru the main foor in the corner of the closet. and a little dryer vent in the side of the basement with its little flaper one way valve for the pressure equilizer.

Did you find any teenagers?? ha

Randen


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