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-   -   Chevy Volt (good earth day post.) (https://ecorenovator.org/forum/showthread.php?t=3665)

AC_Hacker 07-12-15 09:27 AM

Interesting Book on EV Adaptation..
 
I came across a (free) study regarding EV adaptation.

This link is to on-line reading with an option to free download.
Overcoming Barriers to Deployment of Plug-in Electric Vehicles

Best,

-AC

NeilBlanchard 07-13-15 09:28 PM

Have you tried coasting in neutral in the Leaf? You can hold the "shifter" in N for 2s or above 7MPH, just shift into R and it will beep and go into neutral.

Does it still have the stock Bridgestone Ecopia EP422 tires? If so, pump them up to 42-45PSI and coast with the best of them! They are very low rolling resistance tires.

Congrats on the EV. We are thoroughly enjoying our two EV's (Leaf S and e-Golf).

AC_Hacker 07-14-15 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard (Post 45881)
Have you tried coasting in neutral in the Leaf? You can hold the "shifter" in N for 2s or above 7MPH, just shift into R and it will beep and go into neutral.

Does it still have the stock Bridgestone Ecopia EP422 tires? If so, pump them up to 42-45PSI and coast with the best of them! They are very low rolling resistance tires.

Congrats on the EV. We are thoroughly enjoying our two EV's (Leaf S and e-Golf).

I know that tire pressure makes a big difference, I'll check it out.

Thanks for the neutral trick, too. What kind of range increase are you seeing with this?

I did try to take a short trip out of town. I discovered that steady travel gets lower mileage than city... go figure.

My Leaf doesn't have a GPS, and I don't have a smart phone for an app. I do have an inexpensive GPS that I set up a 'button' on, to search for the nearest ChargePoint location. Pretty useful.

Any other tips?

-AC

pinballlooking 07-14-15 09:44 AM

You have to pump up the Volt tires to 45 psi also. It must be how they make those high mileage tires.
Some people use the neutral coasting in the Volt to get more EV miles but you don’t gain that much. We carry a generator around anyway so it is not worth it to me. We have 39,252 EV miles so it not limiting us.

NeilBlanchard 07-14-15 08:49 PM

I like Plugshare.com much better than Chargepoint - Plugshare includes Chargepoint units, plus all the other networks and home chargers that are being shared, as well.

If you open the side windows an inch or two, you get increased air through the vents, and it actually seems to help the drag a bit.

AC_Hacker 07-19-15 04:31 PM

1 Attachment(s)
I was thrashing about in the Leaf's menu system and found lots of interesting pages.

This one was the most interesting...


Right now, the charge point I am using, that is one block away, is free, so that's very good economy.

If I am using house power, that is currently running $0.11/kW-hr.

So that would work out to...

$/mile = 4.1 miles /kW-hr = .11 /4.1 = $0.027 / mile

GeoNRGee said that the price of electricity from the EV stations in Seattle was $0.44/kW-hr, or 4X home charging. It's more expensive, but they do have the expense of constructing the infrastructure to recuperate.

So that works out to .44/4.1 = $0.11 / mile

My daughter just bought a New Honda Odyssey Van that gets about 19 miles to the gallon...

With gas currently at $3.14/gallon, that works out to 3.14/19 = $0.17 / mile

National average miles per gallon is currently 23.6 mpg

That's 3.14/23.6 = $0.13 / mile

My 2000 Honda Insight gets around 55 mpg (avg summer & winter) around town.

That works out to 3.14/55 = $0.06 / mile

If I am out on the highway, and keep my Insight at 55 mph, it can get around 73 mpg.

That works out to... 3.14/73 = $0.043 / mile

All of which makes an electric car a very economical alternative to just about everything except bicycling.

Best,

-AC

pinballlooking 08-04-15 10:22 AM

1 Attachment(s)
The new Chevy Volt 2016 was just EPA tested and it got 53 EV miles.
this is great news. The 2013 was 38 miles and people get 40-45 all the time. They reduced the price some also.

The Results Are In: More Range for the 2016 Volt

http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1438701758

"new 18.4-kWh lithium-ion battery, rated at a combined 106 MPGe, or gasoline equivalent. When the Volt’s battery runs low, a gas-powered generator seamlessly operates to extend the driving range for a total of 420 miles on a full tank.

“We listened to our customers,” said Andrew Farah, vehicle chief engineer, “They were very clear when they told us that they wanted more range, and a fun driving experience behind the wheel. We are confident that the 2016 Volt delivers both.”

The next-generation Volt’s new 1.5L range-extender, designed to use regular unleaded fuel, offers a combined EPA-estimated fuel efficiency of 42 MPG."

Daox 08-04-15 10:43 AM

Those are some great updates.

I didn't see about the price being lowered though?

pinballlooking 08-04-15 10:53 AM

It is because they put out that information a while ago.
This one mentions it.
Rumor: 2016 Chevy Volt gets 53 miles EV range, 40% increase

pinballlooking 08-12-15 09:56 AM

I never saw this EPA number before but it looks very good.

The outgoing 2015 Volt had an electric range of 38 rated miles and the new one is pegged at 53. Less-well known is the EPA rates it for 57 all-electric miles in the city, and 49 all-electric miles highway.

Is The 2016 Volt Worth Buying? - HybridCars.com

pinballlooking 08-19-15 07:27 AM

1 Attachment(s)
We just hit 40,000 EV miles solar powered EV miles on our 2013 Chevy Volt.
We have a total 49,000 miles with only one oil change need so far.

Here are all the real world numbers
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1439987509

Her is a link to just my car.
Volt Stats: Details for Volt #2013-02615 (Flynn's Light Runner)

This site has lost of Volts posting their numbers with OnStar.
Volt Stats! Tracking real world usage of Chevy Volts in the wild...

Elcam84 08-19-15 12:07 PM

Nice. I looked into the volt as a replacement car for loml when she needs a new car. I think she will like it but it'll be a while before we replace the current car. It doesn't make financial sense until she needs a replacement as she it a flight attendant and doesn't even drive 9k a year and her car is paid off.

Speaking of mileage. I ended up with a versa as a rental last weekend in cleveland. Now the daughter has one and complains the mileage isn't great. Well after driving one 150 miles over the weekend I understand. I averaged 30 mpg which is pretty poor. I get that with my 2000 taurus wagon(dohc) and it has much more power and actually accelerates when you push the gas instead of just making noise after a long pause of nothing. I'm just not impressed with the mileage or performance of it. For a tiny car and engine I'd expect better mileage than much larger cars with bigger engines. I'd hate to see what the mileage is on our freeways as the speed limit are pretty slow in ohio. Here in tx I have found the best mileage on my wagon to be at about 75 to 80 depending on how windy it is. Mileage is worse as speed limits are slower.

pinballlooking 09-22-15 01:18 PM

1 Attachment(s)
We have over 42,000 EV (electric vehicle) miles on our 2013 Volt. All solar powered. 51,700 total miles.
It is great to have so many miles powered by the sun.
Only one oil change needed so far.

Here are a few of the top EV mile volts. This data comes from OnStar.

http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1442945920

AC_Hacker 09-23-15 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pinballlooking (Post 47051)
We have over 42,000 EV (electric vehicle) miles on our 2013 Volt. All solar powered. 51,700 total miles.
It is great to have so many miles powered by the sun.
Only one oil change needed so far.

Here are a few of the top EV mile volts. This data comes from OnStar.

http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1442945920

Overall, quite good.

The results from line number 4 are either impressive or fictitious, I can't tell which.

-AC

pinballlooking 09-23-15 10:31 PM

Line 4 is true he is on Facebook. He is crazy he will wait at a public charger just to not use gas. (he has had no rage loss at all )

The Volt goes into maintenance every so often (maybe six months) I am not sure because we never see it. We are just over 80% EV so my gas never gets old.

If this happens and you open your hood you can run the motor with getting any gas miles. This is what he does to limit the gas miles.
We just drive ours but he seems to have fun with it so each his own.

A side note this data comes from OnStar there is no place to manually enter data on the
http://www.voltstats.net/
site.
OnStar gets the data directly for the car.

AC_Hacker 09-24-15 05:30 PM

It's nice that he has really big numbers. However the Engineer in me would discard that value as an erroneous value.

I think he is gaming the system. I mean his mpg number is 42 times greater than the rest of the herd.

It just doesn't mean anything.

-AC

pinballlooking 09-24-15 05:36 PM

Yes I agree with you.

But I think the thing that he says that is very important is no range loss.
He runs almost totally on the battery and charges alot but still gets the same range with more that 80K EV miles on the battery pack.

Water cooled battery pack is doing very well.
Now that is worth talking about.

Roostre 10-15-15 07:50 PM

Great minds... and all that.
 
1 Attachment(s)
Have a Volt myself. Used '13 with fairly low miles. I am commuting 36-37 miles round trip on just the EV. Here's my stats so far:

Attachment 6091

Love this car so far.

BTW- we also have a Leaf. And, yes we are really wanting to do a solar project at some point.

pinballlooking 10-15-15 07:56 PM

Congratulations on the Volt.
I would love to hear you comparison/thoughts between the leaf and the Volt

We did 88 EV miles today with our Volt.

Roostre 10-16-15 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pinballlooking (Post 47469)
Congratulations on the Volt.
I would love to hear you comparison/thoughts between the leaf and the Volt

We did 88 EV miles today with our Volt.

The Volt opened our eyes to the viability of owning an EV. Like most Americans, we probably overestimated how much we actually drive. A few weeks with the Volt not using any gasoline was a true paradigm shift.

My expectations prior to driving the Volt were low. Econo-box offerings from GM have not had the best build quality. My intention was to test drive the thing and check it off my list. But, the Volt is so good that it won me over completely. Comfort, check. Torque, check. Nice amenities, check. This economy car is really a Cadillac in disguise. Good ride, good handling. Very impressed. So I bought one. No regrets.

The Leaf is a different animal. It's mission is different. It is a light, quick nimble street fighter. It's quicker than the Volt (which is impressive from 0-30) and more fun to drive. Both cars seem to lull the driver into a relaxed state that surely helps lower blood pressure in heavy traffic. The range is sufficient, but it is always in the back of your mind. A little more range would take this platform to another level. I can see these evolving into the next classic along the lines of the original VW bug.

When we travel together around town we take the Leaf 95% of the time. It's a great run-around, grocery getter, errand runner. It's also very comfortable. The seats are outstanding. My wife's previous car was a 2003 TDI. I could not drive it more than 10 minutes before the seats caused me discomfort.

We do worry a little more about the Leaf's battery life. With no cooling system it has had some issues in hotter climates. Using Leaf Spy I can see that our Leaf battery has 86% health left. Not bad at 27,500 miles. If it follows the postulated curve for Li-Ion chemistry in our climate, I believe the car will remain viable for our use for at least 5 more years. Ours has the ChadeMo quick charger, which makes emergency fill ups around town easy and fast. Around SLC there are 5 or 6 located in fairly convenient places.

I hope that was what you were asking for. The Leaf and the Volt are both quality offerings. We enjoy them both for different reasons and they compliment each other perfectly. The next step is to install solar so we can drive on the sun like you do!

pinballlooking 10-16-15 01:42 PM

Thanks for the write up. I really like EV’s one size does not fit all so it is great to hear your views.
Owing both lets you have a very unique perspective. Most of us just have one or the other.

pinballlooking 12-01-15 08:36 AM

1 Attachment(s)
We have now driven over 45,000 solar power EV miles with our 2013 Chevy Volt. It is amazing to power a car so many miles on solar power. We still really like the car.

Only one oil change required so far.

http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1448980668

OnStar collects this data.

pinballlooking 12-02-15 11:20 AM

Chevy Volt Crosses 100,000 Sales Milestone
Chevy Volt Crosses 100,000 Sales Milestone | CleanTechnica

I think the 2017 Volt that will be released just after the new year will have sales pickup.

pinballlooking 12-08-15 10:41 AM

2016 Toyota Prius Vs 2016 Chevrolet Volt: Video Test
I thought this was a good comparison between two redesigned cars.
2016 Toyota Prius Vs 2016 Chevrolet Volt: Video Test

pinballlooking 01-18-16 01:45 PM

6 Attachment(s)
My sons and I went to the Greenville SC auto show.
They had the new 2016 Chevy Volt. It is limited release the 2017 will be released everywhere starting in late Feb 2016. This was the first time I have seen one in person.

50 EV miles on a charge I want this battery pack....
I think they did a good job on this car. I was excited to see one in person. The dash and controls have changed for the better. The back seats now have the must have optional seat heaters. I wish mine had that my front seats heat. I bought elect aftermarket seat heater for the back seat in mine.

http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1453146295

Most people get a 7,500 tax credit and some states give a credit on top of that my state SC gives $2,000 tax credit.
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1453147102

http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1453146295

Our 2013 Volt just went over 47K Solar powered EV miles.
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1453147559

We saw a double rainbow when we left the show.
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1453147559

Roostre 01-18-16 02:14 PM

:thumbup:
Congrats on the 47K!!
And thanks for the photos! All great.


Have not had the opportunity to see the Gen2 Volt in person yet, but it looks like GM has really improved the breed from the posts I see on the Volt forums.

Almost afraid to look at them as I already know I will want one badly- my biggest "must have" is the heated steering wheel. After experiencing it in Wife's car it has become a "necessity". :rolleyes:

pinballlooking 01-18-16 02:57 PM

Thanks it is amazing to drive 47K miles on just sun power and have enough solar left the run all our other needs.

Yes heated steering wheel and seats all become important if you have to use heat where you live.

Some people probably don’t realize the volt heater is just like resistive heating and takes miles off your journey if you used too much of it. That is why these features are important with a EV. With a gas burner it is just an extra item an EV it becomes a must have item.

Roostre 01-18-16 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pinballlooking (Post 48814)
Yes heated steering wheel and seats all become important if you have to use heat where you live.

Some people probably don’t realize the volt heater is just like resistive heating and takes miles off your journey if you used too much of it. That is why these features are important with a EV. With a gas burner it is just an extra item an EV it becomes a must have item.

Yep. Because gas motors are only about 27% efficient they have over 70% of the fuel turned to heat. They are actually very good at making waste heat, even when you don't want or need it.

Electric drives make very little waste heat with 90%+ efficiencies. So, as you state; these items become much more important!

I am using ERDTT more the last 30 days as its been very cold here. Love/hate relationship with it. Nice that it makes heat so fast, but hate burning any gas. My commute seems to use about 0.10 gallons so its not too bad.

mejunkhound 01-18-16 11:45 PM

I might convert one of my old cars to electric one of these days, however,

In the meantime, my 1971 Datsun truck cost me $1000 25 years ago, all manual, no AC. It gets 42 MPG (I shut it off coasting downhill, lots of hills here). Well maintained by self.

I get about 3% on my savings.

3% of 46,000 is $1410 a year. At $2 gal for gas these days, that gets me close to 30,000 miles per year for breakeven cost. I only drive about 8K per year.

Even with free solar charge, long time till I fork out big$$ for EV. I'll pay for a couple years of grandkids college with the savings.

Losing game IMO, rebate like buying a bigger house on mortgage so you can deduct the interest ? Now, if gas starts getting near $8 gallon, then maybe, but of course then investment return will likely rise also.

I only posted this because of juvenile envy of the rich <G>

stevehull 01-19-16 06:01 AM

This is NOT a slam against the older and new upcoming Volt. But why would you buy a Volt when the 200 mile range Chevy Bolt is coming out in 6 months?

I admit that I have not studied spec for spec, but the price looks about the same as does the other features (seating, amenities, etc).

Steve

stevehull 01-19-16 06:36 AM

Junkhound.

Your financial analysis of 2016 is spot on with regard to your situation. Mine too.

I have a 2012 Honda Civic with a lifetime gas mileage of 38+ mpg. We own it and the driving costs per mile are low. My wife drives back and forth to work and also has weekend/night call obligations so we put about 20-25 k miles on it every year.

I have watched the prices of gas go up and down over the years. Right now, I can get gasahol at $1.35 /gallon here (Oklahoma). This is LOWER, when adjusted for inflation, than any gas price/gallon ecver (going back 100 years). Yes, lower than the 25 cents/gallon we think of back in the mid 60's.

It will not stay this low for long. With every dip in oil prices, and the media claiming it will stay this low forever - it won't. I expect $150-200 per barrel oil within a few years and gasoline in the $5-7 /gallon range.

And I am planning for that. I have already seen $4.50/gallon (a few summers ago).

In anticipation, I am studying EV plug in cars and what to buy when. This thread has been invaluable The old farmhouse teardown and renovation will include at least 10 kW of rooftop PV. The "return" on investment (internal rate of return) for me when I do self installed PV is in the low 20% range. Yowyza!

I still need internal combustion stuff (tractors, farm trucks etc) so I need diesel. And the cost of fertilizer is directly tied to the cost of petrochemical stocks. Right now, ammonium nitrate is less than $500 per ton - incredibly cheap. So I am not gleefully predicting high petrochemical, oil and natural gas costs.

You do have a point on finances. People that financially "invested" in 1950's bomb shelters, lost a lot of money. You do have to examine the likelihood of events. And being too financially conservative is just as dangerous as being too extravagant.

For now, you are spot on. But I am betting that current teenagers will fondly recall (in many decades) when they bought $1.30/gallon gas. Many will wonder what gasoline per gallon is as they will be thinking of electrical units . . . .

For me, I am betting on large scale adoption of EV. A real inflection point of miles/kWh has just been realized. It is realistic to see 4+ miles/kWh in the next year. Crossing the 4 level is a game changer.

The other game changer is the cost of home grid tied PV power. Right now, all roof top materials (panels, inverters, racking and wiring) can be had for less than $1.25 a watt retail and will likely drop to $1.00/watt this summer. Then add about 2-3 hours of time per kW of panels for installation. That PV price/kW is also an inflection point.

The combination of the two (miles/kWh and prices of PV) makes solar PV and home charging of an EV not only realistic, but actually a saver when I look at my 40 mpg Honda.

Sadly, I am some 15-20 miles out of town and have the bad habit of not being as organized as I should. Therefore, I make stupid trips when I could consolidate them. A PV powered plug in EV (or hybrid) can accommodate my poor planning and make it less bad.

I too have some envy for those adopters that comment here. Kids in college makes choices tough, but they are graduating and getting JOBS - yippee!

Thanks to all of you that have posted on your PV solar and EV experiences good and bad. I read with envy and anticipation.


Steve

pinballlooking 01-19-16 07:50 AM

The Bolt will not be for everybody. If you want to have only one car and you go on vacation and not rent a car for vacation the Volt is a better choice. We drive to NC and GA in the Volt the Bolt can’t easily do those trips. My wife has days she drive over 200 miles but sense we have a Tahoe we could switch cars on those days.

EV’s will not make sense for everyone. Used Volts and other EV are way down in price. When you go to the Volt forum only a small percent of the buyers buy because of savings. Fun quite drive and the environment are much higher that savings.

I have a GM credit card and the send me incentives. The deal when I bought my car.
$9,000 Off MSRP- Rebates Total $6,000 + dealer discount (GM card top off $3,000 + preferred $1,000) $2,000 GM rebate
$9500Tax credits (fed $7500 SC state $2,000)
When you take $18,500 off the price it does not seem as bad anymore. Plus 0% for 72 months.

I don’t have a lot of deductions so I really loved not paying so much into the tax man for a year.

Even at the gas prices right now we still save a fair amount each month but we drive a lot more than most people. As always the more you spend the more you have to save.
There are saving there when you add solar to the mix. I save more on gas each month than elect. Even at today’s prices. I do not think these prices will last.

But I do find it funny that as soon as prices went down large SUV sales went through the roof. Some of those same people will be locked into a large SUV when gas pieces are back up. Some of them will not be able to afford to drive them. But I say the majority of people if not all on here do not fall into that trap.

Roostre 01-19-16 10:06 AM

I bought both my EVs used and at substantial discounts.

I used $3 per gallon to compare to my old car that was paid off. At the time buying the Volt meant I broke even in about 4 years. With lower gas prices that will take longer, but I have far less maintenance and no regrets.

The Leaf replaced a car my wife had driven for 13 years. Perhaps we could have driven it a few more years, but it was getting worn out and needed some expensive work. The Leaf was under $9000 and it fulfills her needs nicely. She was going to buy a new car either way, so electric made sense for the replacement.

Now we just need to talk our neighbor to the south into trimming his 200 ft Chinese elms back so that we can install a solar system.

Roostre 01-19-16 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mejunkhound (Post 48816)
I might convert one of my old cars to electric one of these days, however,

Losing game IMO, rebate like buying a bigger house on mortgage so you can deduct the interest ? Now, if gas starts getting near $8 gallon, then maybe, but of course then investment return will likely rise also.

I only posted this because of juvenile envy of the rich <G>

I've been a subscriber an infrequent contributor to the EVDL (Electric Vehicle Discussion List) list since dial up internet days. I've been wanting to do an electric vehicle conversion for all those years, but raising kids and keeping the family afloat has meant it was always too expensive.

Even using the lowest cost DIY methods you will have to spend a fair chunk of change for good batteries. When I saw that you can now buy entire PROFESSIONALLY ENGINEERED cars for less than the cost of the conversion parts I jumped in.

Of course, there are now people buying damaged Leafs and Teslas and using the batteries and drivetrain to do a less expensive conversion.

We are far from wealthy. We just looked at the return on investment. Recently a Volt was listed in the local classifieds for $10,500. For the right person that car could easily pay itself back with fuel savings.

Sorry if I've rambled on too much.

Roostre 01-19-16 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevehull (Post 48817)
This is NOT a slam against the older and new upcoming Volt. But why would you buy a Volt when the 200 mile range Chevy Bolt is coming out in 6 months?

Because there are no USED Bolts. In 3 or 4 years it may become an attractive alternative. :thumbup:

pinballlooking 01-19-16 10:47 AM

When I bought mine in 2013 there were no good used Volt deals I look as far as FL. They we all about the same as me buying new. (after the 7500 tax fed credit and our 2k state credit.) That is not the case now there are some very good deals out there now.
We drive enough miles that mine will pay for its self not many cars out there will do that.
I have done only one oil change so far 58K miles. That adds to the savings and saves me some work/time not having to get under the car near as much.

pinballlooking 02-08-16 04:08 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Our 2013 Volt just went over 48K Solar powered EV miles. Only one oil change needed so far.
what a great way to use solar power. We should netzero this year again.

http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1454969320


I just went out to VoltStat and sparkie now has 293K miles wow with 103K EV miles.

http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1454970196

pinballlooking 03-24-16 08:13 PM

This is pretty impressive.

Durable 2012 Chevrolet Volt: 300,000 miles, no battery loss
Durable 2012 Chevrolet Volt: 300,000 miles, no battery loss

pinballlooking 04-14-16 03:45 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Chevy quoted me on their face book page.
We are now at over 51,230 solar powered miles but still cool.
http://ecorenovator.org/forum/attach...1&d=1460666895

Roostre 04-14-16 04:22 PM

That is an awesome achievement!!

Continuing to love our Volt.


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