EcoRenovator - View Single Post - Back Up Heat Source and Boosting Loop Temps

randen · 01-28-14, 05:21 PM

Wewantutopia

I'm part of the motley crew.

Having first hand experience with Geo-thermal I would compare the price per unit heat BTU Geo vs. High efficiency Natural gas very close dollar per dollar. In reality you would be comparing two highly efficient systems But there are other factors at play. Like what AC-hacker pointed out. Warming a ground loop with summer air-conditioning and using that same stored heat for winter. An central air unit would just pump the summer heat out to the wind and not be able to recapture that heat.

To try to improve the efficiency of a geo-thermal with a resistance or N-gas type boost for the heat-pump could end up to be expensive. After all your really basically heating using an other source and having a heat-pump then move that heat to where you need it. You may be better to use direct source like a gas fireplace or small space heater to get you by the worst condition. This way you don't pay twice. Once for the heat and again to move it.

A heat-pump is just that: It doesn't make heat it just moves it from one area to another. Its less expensive to move it from the warm ground to the home. And the other way as well from a warm home into the cooler ground.

Really the best heat is the free stuff. From the sun. In essence that's what the Geo-thermal is doing is gathering the heat that the sun put into the ground the season before. But keep in mind you still have to pay to move it. As well a Geo-thermal system can be a sizable investment.

The second best kept secrete is OR maybe the first "Keeping the heat you just paid for". (insulation)

Maybe the lack of interest in insulation is the lack of techie stuff. No pumps, temp gauges, heavy power cables and a plethora of plumbing. Insulation is put into cavities and hidden in manners never to be noticed. A handy guy could wrap a house in 6" of foam boards from soffit to footing and then cover with siding or stucco and backfill never seeing his underlying work of art.

For instance using your gas furnace. If your home had an R-100 insulation wrap, that same gas furnace might only operate once every second day. You would keep every BTU. and be comfortable for a long time.

If you check into some of the Net-Zero homes that are heated with solar heat only with possibly a very small back-up heat source the insulation values of the home's envelope are almost extreme compared to a typically constructed home. These homes can almost be heated by the warm bodies that occupy them.

Its a great time to be looking at the possibilities. The technologies are avalible now for a reasonable dollar. Couple that with DIY and sweat equity you can be kept warm and comfortable.

Thinking again in the direction of net-zero home tech.The cost for solar PV panels has dropped significantly. Imagine an extremely well insulated home with geo thermal operated from those same panels heating a concrete floor that remains warm for a couple days. Hot water which is considered 20% of the energy budget heated by the same PV panels. LEDs lighting your home very in-expensively.

We have been collecting solar heated hot water for space heating our home(the free stuff) and Geo-thermal as a back-up or as this winter has been very cold and over-cast more our primary source. Higher performance insulation is our saving grace and a better return on investment.

My humble suggestion is insulation. A deep renovation of insulation and air infiltration curtailment is better bang for the buck. Out-sulation is the tech. of the day. Wrapping a home with layers of foam board clear down to the footings and triple glaze high performance windows.

Randen

01-28-14, 05:21 PM	#4
randen Uber EcoRenovator Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Strathroy Ontario Canada Posts: 657 Thanks: 9 Thanked 191 Times in 129 Posts	The quest: Lots of heat, few dollars Wewantutopia I'm part of the motley crew. Having first hand experience with Geo-thermal I would compare the price per unit heat BTU Geo vs. High efficiency Natural gas very close dollar per dollar. In reality you would be comparing two highly efficient systems But there are other factors at play. Like what AC-hacker pointed out. Warming a ground loop with summer air-conditioning and using that same stored heat for winter. An central air unit would just pump the summer heat out to the wind and not be able to recapture that heat. To try to improve the efficiency of a geo-thermal with a resistance or N-gas type boost for the heat-pump could end up to be expensive. After all your really basically heating using an other source and having a heat-pump then move that heat to where you need it. You may be better to use direct source like a gas fireplace or small space heater to get you by the worst condition. This way you don't pay twice. Once for the heat and again to move it. A heat-pump is just that: It doesn't make heat it just moves it from one area to another. Its less expensive to move it from the warm ground to the home. And the other way as well from a warm home into the cooler ground. Really the best heat is the free stuff. From the sun. In essence that's what the Geo-thermal is doing is gathering the heat that the sun put into the ground the season before. But keep in mind you still have to pay to move it. As well a Geo-thermal system can be a sizable investment. The second best kept secrete is OR maybe the first "Keeping the heat you just paid for". (insulation) Maybe the lack of interest in insulation is the lack of techie stuff. No pumps, temp gauges, heavy power cables and a plethora of plumbing. Insulation is put into cavities and hidden in manners never to be noticed. A handy guy could wrap a house in 6" of foam boards from soffit to footing and then cover with siding or stucco and backfill never seeing his underlying work of art. For instance using your gas furnace. If your home had an R-100 insulation wrap, that same gas furnace might only operate once every second day. You would keep every BTU. and be comfortable for a long time. If you check into some of the Net-Zero homes that are heated with solar heat only with possibly a very small back-up heat source the insulation values of the home's envelope are almost extreme compared to a typically constructed home. These homes can almost be heated by the warm bodies that occupy them. Its a great time to be looking at the possibilities. The technologies are avalible now for a reasonable dollar. Couple that with DIY and sweat equity you can be kept warm and comfortable. Thinking again in the direction of net-zero home tech.The cost for solar PV panels has dropped significantly. Imagine an extremely well insulated home with geo thermal operated from those same panels heating a concrete floor that remains warm for a couple days. Hot water which is considered 20% of the energy budget heated by the same PV panels. LEDs lighting your home very in-expensively. We have been collecting solar heated hot water for space heating our home(the free stuff) and Geo-thermal as a back-up or as this winter has been very cold and over-cast more our primary source. Higher performance insulation is our saving grace and a better return on investment. My humble suggestion is insulation. A deep renovation of insulation and air infiltration curtailment is better bang for the buck. Out-sulation is the tech. of the day. Wrapping a home with layers of foam board clear down to the footings and triple glaze high performance windows. Randen Attached Images Last edited by Daox; 01-28-14 at 05:28 PM..