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Old 04-21-17, 08:52 AM   #1
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Default Senville Aura ASHP

I have been looking at the Senville Aura 36k dual system for my house. I was watching the Gree Crown series but they increased in price, making them less attractive. The Senville 36k dual shows a SEER of 22.5 in their catalog. I have a ~2000sf two story house, very tight and well insulated. It is an open floor plan so I am thinking a 24k IDU downstairs for primarily heating and an 18K IDU upstairs for cooling in the summer. Heat flows upstairs pretty well to heat the upstairs family room from the wood stove so I think this will work out well. The room upstairs doesn't currently have a heater in it and doesn't seem to need one. The bedrooms upstairs have baseboard electric to supplement the natural convection.
I am surprised the Aura series aren't mentioned more since they heat down to -22F like the Gree. I would like to hear from anyone who has direct experience with Senville.
Also has anyone used one of the low end Chinese vacuum pumps off of Ebay? They get down to around $50. Just curious. I am shopping for tools if anyone has recommendations. I see that the cheap hose kits can be a problem.
The upstairs IDU will be on an inside wall and the line set will need to snake through an unheated attic. I was really worried about the drain line freezing until I read a comment that there is no condensation in heat mode. I was thinking that the ODU should be mounted 3-4 feet off the ground to minimize snow issues on the prevailing leeward side of the house. I do have a large deck I could put it under but, it isn't as good a spot to run lines from nad it sees huge wind off of the lake.

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Bill

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Old 04-21-17, 11:19 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H16bill View Post
I have been looking at the Senville Aura 36k dual system for my house. I was watching the Gree Crown series but they increased in price, making them less attractive. The Senville 36k dual shows a SEER of 22.5 in their catalog. I have a ~2000sf two story house, very tight and well insulated. It is an open floor plan so I am thinking a 24k IDU downstairs for primarily heating and an 18K IDU upstairs for cooling in the summer. Heat flows upstairs pretty well to heat the upstairs family room from the wood stove so I think this will work out well. The room upstairs doesn't currently have a heater in it and doesn't seem to need one. The bedrooms upstairs have baseboard electric to supplement the natural convection.
I am surprised the Aura series aren't mentioned more since they heat down to -22F like the Gree. I would like to hear from anyone who has direct experience with Senville.
Also has anyone used one of the low end Chinese vacuum pumps off of Ebay? They get down to around $50. Just curious. I am shopping for tools if anyone has recommendations. I see that the cheap hose kits can be a problem.
The upstairs IDU will be on an inside wall and the line set will need to snake through an unheated attic. I was really worried about the drain line freezing until I read a comment that there is no condensation in heat mode. I was thinking that the ODU should be mounted 3-4 feet off the ground to minimize snow issues on the prevailing leeward side of the house. I do have a large deck I could put it under but, it isn't as good a spot to run lines from nad it sees huge wind off of the lake.

cheers
Bill
Heat pumps are required by law to have a rated value of performance. SEER is the value almost all sales literature emphasizes. Salesmen are the same way.

But there is another value of performance you need to look at: HSPF. Many salesmen have never heard of it. And some sales literature will omit this value. You may have to dig for it.

SEER was developed for air conditioners. If you have a 'heat pump' SEER is important for cooling, and also may or may not indicate heating efficiency.

HSPF stands for Heating Season Performance Factor. It is the figure of merit for seasonal heating.

So, if winter heating is your primary concern, you will want a system that has the highest HSPF, and SEER values could be of secondary importance.

If summer cooling is your primary concern, the opposite would be true.

Hope this helps,

-AC_Hacker
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Old 04-21-17, 11:31 AM   #3
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Are you sure that it heats down to -22F?
Mine only heathe pumps down to -5F, which if I remember correctly is around -20C.

Mine starts using electric heat below freezing.
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Old 04-21-17, 12:04 PM   #4
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OilPan 4,
That's what the literature for the Aura series says (-22F/-30C). The Senville Leto series goes down to 5F. Sounds like that might be what you have.

AC_Hacker
The HSPF4 is 10.2 for the one I'm looking at. Its not 12 but seems ok. That's why I am posting to see if I am missing something before I dive in.
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Old 04-22-17, 12:14 PM   #5
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OilPan 4,
That's what the literature for the Aura series says (-22F/-30C). The Senville Leto series goes down to 5F. Sounds like that might be what you have.

AC_Hacker
The HSPF4 is 10.2 for the one I'm looking at. Its not 12 but seems ok. That's why I am posting to see if I am missing something before I dive in.
You can take the HSPF and devide by 3.14 to get COP.

If you really dig into the literature for your heat pump choices, you should be able to find charts that illustrate the decline of COP as a result of temperature decline.

In the end, it's not only money but also the amount of coal burned (CO2 created) to provide heat.

-AC
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Old 04-23-17, 08:29 AM   #6
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Ok, so doing some quick googling, I found out what these Senville units are. Senville has a building in Compton, CA and not much else. The company is a subsidiary of GT WORLD MACHINERIES INC. Based out of Montreal. Looking further, GTWMI imports air conditioners from Midea. Using batman logic, I would say the Senville units are of Midea design. Since Midea sells their own units, these Senville units are most likely not a bleeding-edge design, but rather dated technology. Good for reliability, maybe not so good for high efficiency.

Not trying to disrespect Senville or anything, but I imagine if I looked further, GTWMI probably has other subsidiary brands trademarked elsewhere in the world, and maybe even in 'merica. The only document on their website that shows a refrigerant cycle diagram shows capillary tubes as the metering device. Not bad for air conditioning, but the sub-zero performance stated is impossible with cap tubes. It is entirely possible that Senville is behind on their website, and the new units have some sort of PID control and electronic expansion valves and such in them. Then again, maybe not.
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Old 04-23-17, 11:56 PM   #7
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AC Hacker,

I have the Senville Aura 12k and the Gree Terra 24K, 9K, and 9K.

There is no comparison in the quality or operations of the two manufacturers. The Gree remotes are more logical, The "auto" mode on the Gree is nice holding temperature between 68 and 77. Aura tries to hold plus or minus 2 degrees and thus runs more and is noisier in any mode. Outdoors the condensers are similar in size but the Gree is slightly quieter.

I could detail it all day but the old adage "you get what you pay for" seems to be especially true when comparing these two manufacturers. Sometimes there is more to it than SEER and COP.

If money is available to step up to the Gree Crown, do it.
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Old 04-24-17, 12:02 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by jeff5may View Post
Ok, so doing some quick googling, I found out what these Senville units are. Senville has a building in Compton, CA and not much else. The company is a subsidiary of GT WORLD MACHINERIES INC. Based out of Montreal. Looking further, GTWMI imports air conditioners from Midea. Using batman logic, I would say the Senville units are of Midea design. Since Midea sells their own units, these Senville units are most likely not a bleeding-edge design, but rather dated technology. Good for reliability, maybe not so good for high efficiency.

Not trying to disrespect Senville or anything, but I imagine if I looked further, GTWMI probably has other subsidiary brands trademarked elsewhere in the world, and maybe even in 'merica. The only document on their website that shows a refrigerant cycle diagram shows capillary tubes as the metering device. Not bad for air conditioning, but the sub-zero performance stated is impossible with cap tubes. It is entirely possible that Senville is behind on their website, and the new units have some sort of PID control and electronic expansion valves and such in them. Then again, maybe not.
The current Aura (which I have) is a version 2 model which honestly seems to heat better than it cools. In my opinion it does not remove warm weather humidity as well as my units from other manufacturers so you can be somewhat cool but sticky.
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Old 04-24-17, 12:24 AM   #9
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Regarding vacuum pumps, I got my $50 one off of Amazon and it works great. Use the money saved to buy quality hoses and gauges. You do not want to buy cheap there.
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Old 04-25-17, 09:19 AM   #10
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I looked at the Medea units. They have some that will heat down to -22F but the specs seem just a bit different from the Senvilles. The Medea units are marketed a bit differently. More options for IDU (floor, concealed) and no included line set. They don't seem to have the same 36k dual (18k, 24k) that I was considering in the Medea line.

Looking at vacuum gauges. I like the Fieldpiece svg3 but it seems that there are a bunch of defective ones being sold. Looking at the Avg2 that used a mutimeter for the display. I think my DVM has a 200mv scale but I am not sure how accurate this would be. Anyone using this? Any vacuum gauge recommendations?

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